This is maybe a wierd question, but..

Do the outside edges of the brushes of a map that are exposed to the outside of the map(where there is nothing) affect clipnodes in any way? For instance, I have attached a screenshot of what the bottom of my map looks like. Most of the time I have it set up like this, so that the bottom of all the brushes mostly come to the same level. What I want to ask is If I brought them ALL down to the same level, would that affect anything on compile? Either positively or negatively?

i dont think it makes a difference in game.. it might make a small compile difference.. but i honestly dont know.

Originally posted by Taien
This is maybe a wierd question, but..

Do the outside edges of the brushes of a map that are exposed to the outside of the map(where there is nothing) affect clipnodes in any way? For instance, I have attached a screenshot of what the bottom of my map looks like. Most of the time I have it set up like this, so that the bottom of all the brushes mostly come to the same level. What I want to ask is If I brought them ALL down to the same level, would that affect anything on compile? Either positively or negatively?

bringing it all down to the same level at the bottom of the map won't make any difference at all in game, because when the maps compiled anything covered with the null texture is ignored by the engine, so you're fine doing that and it also helps stop leaks keeping everything the same length ;)

You shouldn't even have to worry about a null texture, anything that touches the void will be cut from the level and no clip nodes will be placed on those. Usualy theres only 1 or 2 clipnodes per brush if they are the wall between the inside and the void.

Clipnodes are calculated during compile to determinate where the player can or can't go (ie to prevent player to go in a hole smaller than his own dimensions!).
The calculations do litteraly scan the inside of the map, imagine it as a ball traveling everywhere, making additional performs for overlapping brushes (thus longer compile). Clipnodes are only affected by what is inside the map. And this of course has to be found during compile.
I wonder if your map will compile faster with outside brushes aligned? Also the difference impact on the clipnodes (check this difference with -chart as parameter for the compile tools) ? ...

Originally posted by Ca-Chicken-Soup
You shouldn't even have to worry about a null texture, anything that touches the void will be cut from the level and no clip nodes will be placed on those. Usualy theres only 1 or 2 clipnodes per brush if they are the wall between the inside and the void.

it needs to be nulled no matter what even if it is cut when compiled, it makes the compile tools job alot easier, besides when mapping you should make all brushes in null first then texture them, makes for less trouble in the end.

Originally posted by Sly Assassin
you should make all brushes in null first then texture them, makes for less trouble in the end.

*Sigh*



Yup someone could have told me that at the begining... but nooooooooo. Anyways yeah that aucutaly sounds good... because of all the insides of the brushes that touch.. but anyways.


Hey Sly not sure if ya recignise me from the gameplanet forums but hi! nice to see another NZ mapper.

Originally posted by Sly Assassin
it needs to be nulled no matter what even if it is cut when compiled, it makes the compile tools job alot easier, besides when mapping you should make all brushes in null first then texture them, makes for less trouble in the end.

Yeah, I figured that part out a long time ago :) That's why they're all null in the pic...I always make my brushes start out as completely null and throw textures on the sides that are exposed....the first map I made I didn't do that and had to go through the inside of all the walls and null them all off...Ugh!!

Originally posted by Taien
Yeah, I figured that part out a long time ago :) That's why they're all null in the pic...I....the first map I made I didn't do that and had to go through the inside of all the walls and null them all off...Ugh!!

Yeah... huh... what a fool...

Its not like I've spent the last 10 hours nulling and retexturing my map. Its going to be so much fun with leaks after this.

so the moral of this story is: FOR GODS SAKE, LISTEN TO SLY

And read lotsa tutorials before you start.

Another small advantage of doing this is the BSP can be a lot smaller using NULL on unseen faces.

Check out the size of dod_jocund BSP relitive to the playing area.

It makes for a quick download even on fastdownload servers.

*sigh* yeah but after nulling the entire map and texturing only the inside faces there are now a lot of invisible non-existant leaks. I expected it though.
Oh well all in the name of efficency and small map size.

NULL texture or not, a leaks a leak.

If the brushes that face the void don't touch each other (walls, skys ... etc) you will get a leak, don't matter if the unseen sides are NULL or not.

sorry ...

Cant the void invade through the null texture? *makes a test map* Brb...

*EDIT* Ah ok I see... so null doesn't cause leaks... crap so now I have a real problem. My pointfiles don't lead anywhere near the enititys that are stated near a leak.

/Locks self in dungeon for 8 weeks

The entity is supposed to be the nerest entity to the leak. If you search these forums you should find a reason why, sometimes, its not.

The RED part of the line is where the leak is.

Originally posted by haircut
The entity is supposed to be the nerest entity to the leak.

Yeah but don't rely on that, I just cleaned up about 4 leaks with two or three entities closer than the ones pointed to. Anyways my pointfile fixed its sorry ass and now my map compiles :D schweet!