OK I said I was going to release this map after 1.0 but I have, like most people, run into problems with this new version. However I can now map again, and am about 98% complete with this map. This will be my first released map. Just wanted to remind you guys that I am here and I hope that some will remember this as it has been awhile.

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_shell0002.JPG

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_shell0007.JPG (and BTW I fixed the func-illusionary problem in the second pic)

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_shell0010.JPG

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_shell0003.JPG

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_shell0005.JPG

Thats all for now will release when its done! Please comment on what you think. Thanks.

yeah, that looks really good! But I think it's to dark, gj anyway

I'd really like to comment on it, but the pictures are too dark for me to see anything. Is it a beach map?

oh, and change the color of that smoke :)

Looks good man.... its really hard to see anying about the layout and get a feel for the map from the shots so far so good I must say.

The first picture might seem a little flat but since I dont know anything about the map its hard to comment. :)

It's... dark... :|




....buuut that might be a good thing.. Cant really say until I've tried the map.

Inside is wonderful. Outside, hum... light_env + 30, what do you think?
Looking for the release ! :) We have the fps, what about r_speeds?

it looks like one of those maps that will b much fun to play....

it not a beach map i think, it looks liek just an attack accross a battlefile, but i may b wrong

Oh and r_speeds= less than 900 outside/ inside bunker never more than 600. And about that lighting, I think you guys are going to want it dark, besides that terrain and a couple shellholes, I wanted it to be a tough crawl/ ass-in-the-grass type of atmosphere for the allies. Speaking of terrain, maybe the pic outside wasn't that good because the land is pretty "rolly" if you know what I mean. And with the smoke grenade, what color do you think I should change it to?

And here is objectives: While there is the normal "flag capture" gameplay, I have a number of secondary objectives that will add to the team's score. Allies need to blow up an 88 Artillery gun, and steal secret documents(hence the name "akte"). All the while the Axis's main focus is holding the Allies back and recapturing flags. It is an incremental spawn type map so once the allies get inside the bunker, they spawn forward. Axis start above ground to defend against the assault. Allies have 15 minutes to capture flags or allies win.

What do ya think?

looking good and dark. Just like everyone else said. Just add some lights and ill give it a go!

here is an old crap-lighting pic to show terrain

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_finalcompile10011.JPG

And with the good lighting, can you really not see anything or were you just confused with the theme of the map?

Nice craters there, got a real "organic" feel. And I love that indoor shoot - looks damp and cold like a bunker should be.

dude its too dark for a dod map. The darkness doesnt suit the skybox either... make it lighter and its gonna be great I think :)

Wow I'm a little surprised about the lighting issue. Last time I previewed this, everyone said the lighting was perfect for a dawn type of skybox. I guess if everyone continues to dislike it, I will brighten it up but not much more. I have a flat screen moniter so I usually have to turn up gamma to see anything dark (for example the tunnels in de_dust) and in-game it seems very dark, but a good dark, if you know what I mean ;).

Dont change the lighting!!! just add some search lights( i am still not sure if this is completley possible...) and lamps around the bunker area.

:D

Hmm I think having some dark maps would be nice by now. Hedgerow was cut in v1.0 and we don't see a lot of quality dark maps these days. Yes I say quality because I like what I see here in these pics.

Keep up the good work :)

I'd like to hear some more comments on the lighting, or just the overall appeal to the screenshots. Come on people 195 views and only 15 posts! Thanks.

Aye...she's a beauty...eh?

Don't change a thing...I'm a fan of dark maps...

Now...release her so I can explore it ;)

Originally posted by Mexikilla
Oh and r_speeds= less than 900 outside/ inside bunker never more than 600. And about that lighting, I think you guys are going to want it dark, besides that terrain and a couple shellholes, I wanted it to be a tough crawl/ ass-in-the-grass type of atmosphere for the allies. Speaking of terrain, maybe the pic outside wasn't that good because the land is pretty "rolly" if you know what I mean. And with the smoke grenade, what color do you think I should change it to?

And here is objectives: While there is the normal "flag capture" gameplay, I have a number of secondary objectives that will add to the team's score. Allies need to blow up an 88 Artillery gun, and steal secret documents(hence the name "akte"). All the while the Axis's main focus is holding the Allies back and recapturing flags. It is an incremental spawn type map so once the allies get inside the bunker, they spawn forward. Axis start above ground to defend against the assault. Allies have 15 minutes to capture flags or allies win.

What do ya think?

I think it looks fun. The interior shots make me think 'its going to take way too much time for me to be able to map like that'

Keep it at least semi-dark. The fact that they have 0 dark maps in DoD v1 annoys me. Keep up the good mapping :P

Screenshots always seem to be deceptive when it comes to how dark things actually are, and if it is too dark it's often just a case of being only a little too dark - a slight tweak to the light environment often makes all the difference.

So I say leave it dark, release it when it's ready as a beta and if the consensus is it is still too dark tweak it then.

Originally posted by DMW_NZ
Screenshots always seem to be deceptive when it comes to how dark things actually are, and if it is too dark it's often just a case of being only a little too dark - a slight tweak to the light environment often makes all the difference.

So I say leave it dark, release it when it's ready as a beta and if the consensus is it is still too dark tweak it then.

Yup that what I was planning on doing

looks great mate, I like the darkness, gives me that creepy feeling that someones going to sneak up on me sorta thing ya know ;)
Keep up the good work mate _b

Originally posted by Hulk Bogan
Aye...she's a beauty...eh?

Don't change a thing...I'm a fan of dark maps...


Yes! Please DON'T change the lighting! When it's just bright enough to see what is needed to see, but still dark enough to see a muzzle flash come from out of nowhere.... ahhhhh. RELEASE! lol

Problem with dark maps is there always will be some players which manage to get it brighter on their computers. Then they will ruin everyone's ele game cause 'default' people will be frustrated. Don't make it so dark. I can hardly see anything on my screen.
Last pic has optimal lighting IMO.

I don't understand why some people complain about dark spots in peoples maps. Darkness is part of reality...and I'm pretty sure that there was fighting going on in even dark places during the war. I doubt armies said..."I'm not going in there untill It's lighter..."

There's several things to remember here.

One, is that some darkness might be exactly what the mapper had in his vision for his map. People need to stop complaining about how dark other peoples maps are...and try instead to see the artistic vision that may have played a part in the maps lighting and creation.

Appreciation is key, and remember you can please some of the people some of the time, but you can never please all of the people.

Two, is that darker maps, or maps with dark areas should slow the gameplay down a bit. This too might be what the mappper had in mind. DoD I'm sure was never intended to be a CounterStrike "RUN-N-GUN" type mod. The players that burst from room to room in mad dashes, guns constantly blazing are definately going to be upset by some strategic lighting. Those type players should play games more suited to their tastes. Games like CS or Q3 where the settings are always mapped with that type gameplay in mind might be better suited for those type players.

God forbid, you might actually have to slow down a bit and check before barging into a dark room where an enemy might be hiding.

For heavens sake...if you see a dark room...don't just run in, get shot, and then complain about the room being dark. Give credit to the guy that is using the map to his advantage. Give credit to the mapper that didn't follow the sheep and make every room perfectly lit.

Completely black is bad I would agree...but dark is not. I don't know about anyone else, but I dig some dark areas in maps. It increases the challenge, it forces me to employ tactics other than run, shoot, duck behind crate, reload, repeat.

And about peeps turning up their monitors to compensate for darkness...well they can do that and many other tricks to give themselves an advantage...lighting in a particular map is irrelevant. No matter what the map looks like...nothing is stopping anyone from boosting their monitors brightness to try and get a cheap advantage over other players.

The way I look at it is this. If some shmo wants his/her game to look like ****e just so he can cheat...too bad for him/her. They are ruining what the mapper intended for them to see, and that is their loss...not yours.

When I download any map and look at it, I try very hard not to tear it to shreds with criticism, but instead try to see what the mappers vision might have been. I guess what I'm trying to say is that not every map will be to your tastes, and some will grow on you after time, but you should try to above all else, appreciate the mappers vision. Appreciate different maps and map styles. Wouldn't it be pretty boring if all the maps carried the same textures or lighting...just different layouts?

Nine times out of ten...what you see is what the mapper envisioned to begin with.

And after all...I personally think it would suck if all the maps out there looked and felt similar. How fast would that grow old?

Anywho...just thought I'd chime in here because I have seen sooo many posts on various forums about "dark maps". People need to stop being afraid of the dark...embrace the dark side...er...um...something like that. :)

Mr. Binary

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_finalcompile10011.JPG
I remember this pic! I love that open area, and there's just enough cover provided by those craters. I think there should be more open maps, but working out the r_speeds is a beast.

Originally posted by Mr.Binary
People need to stop being afraid of the dark...embrace the dark side...er...um...something like that. :)

Mr. Binary

LOL yah! Great post, dark maps really do give a certain atmosphere to the gameplay that would not be there during the day. Since you guys have not played this yet all I can say is if you're allies you are NOT going to be wanting more light. When I starting getting the idea for this map, I imagined that an frontal assault like this probaly would have been during cover of darkness (unless the commander was a complete tactical idiot and wanted all his troops dead) so thats why it might seem darker than most other night maps.

Anyways I thought I'd let you guys know that I am thinking of no snipers on both sides. Since I am a strong advocate of no sniping on beach maps, and since the opening assault can be similar to a beach landing, I am probaly going to do it. I really want the germans to be deploying their mgs for more than a couple of seconds, and I hope the allies will use the terrain/darkness to their advantage in that you could probably get pretty close to the german line just quietly crawling than trying to do a mad dash guns blazing across the field.

I am excited to see what what players will come up with to make it across the field. It could be sneaky "surprise" attack, could be a quick dash across the field with surpressive fire at the rear, or it could be the first one gone terribly wrong and then have to charge the last feet, dive into the trench, and clear the bunker. Whatever happens though, I hope teamwork is key for either team to win.

I'll keep you updated, thanks for anymore replies that come...

sry mexikilla, i looked at your pics, but i had to go into the shower!

so here is my opinion:

looks amazing, i like the bunkers! and i dunno understand why the other guys in this forum lame about the darkness and the dark sky! i think that´s very cool!

keep it growing! :D

Originally posted by Mr.Binary
No matter what the map looks like...nothing is stopping anyone from boosting their monitors brightness to try and get a cheap advantage over other players.
The way I look at it is this. If some shmo wants his/her game to look like ****e just so he can cheat...too bad for him/her. They are ruining what the mapper intended for them to see, and that is their loss...not yours. Well, dear Mr Binary Junior Member, you can't say it's only their problem. It isn't. It affects other's entertainment - in this case no fun at all. On such dark map I can easily image honest "default" player's gameplay: You will be constantly killed by people hiding in dark spots (everywhere) until you get frustrated so highly so you exit server or bump up all you brightness options to the max. There is a reason why you don't have any dark maps in 1.0 - you can't do equally bright map for everyone. Computer's monitors and graphics cards differ too much. For some this map will be pitch black, for other it will look like full moon night.

So this all whining about too much darkness have sense if author want his map to be played. It's not because 'there are some idiots which simply don't like dark maps' :(.

Mexikilla:
Anyway my advice is to make this map brighter. Of course you can do what you want, this is your map

Craftos said:

Well, dear Mr Binary Junior Member

Well well well...Junior member on a board...you put me in my place didn't you. ;)

Anywho...just try to remember this...not all dod players are afraid of the dark. Not all dod players are going to spend all round in a dark corner.

And you mentioned something about how that's why all the 1.0 maps are bright...hrmmm. All the maps looking similar is a good thing?

This kinda reminds me of how so many people complained about people using the sniper rifle in CS.

This kinda reminds me of the occasional CS player that shows up and complains about people "camping"...when camping is an essential part of dod. DOH!

Maybe next, we can all complain about potholes...or sniper spots...or...certain weapons...or...sprites...or...

Don't complain and get all frustrated about the chump who keeps killing you from dark corners...be a better player, and find a way to kill him. Simple.

No one is forcing you to ruin your own game. YOU are in control of YOUR game. No one else. If you are the type of player who gets frustrated like that, you are right...there are many many servers out there for you to jump in. Bail off the server filled with the players you are having trouble with, and find a new one. Problem solved. But to expect all maps and all servers and all players to play to YOUR tastes, well thats just unreasonable, Mr. Senior Member.

And I would also say to you, that if you DO find yourself getting all frustrated and filled with your brimming rage over a player who is using dark to his/her advantage, maybe you just need to take a break from the game and calm down. Take some time off and then go play again. Just don't smash your mouse or keyboard and cost yourself money.

Hope this didn't come across too nasty, but I sensed a bit of smarmy attitude in your reply. I felt a rebuttle was in order. Lets keep it civil, no need to try and be condescending because you have posted more than I.

Mr. Binary

I can't be bothered to read the other posts, but heres what I think

- Terrain, good; Pretty :D

- Lighting, good; I am a big fan of Dark maps, I know how difficult it is to get the lighting right on a dark map. Especially as its a beach map, its keeping it balances as the invaders are harder to spot...gj :D

Originally posted by El Capitan
[B Especially as its a beach map, its keeping it balances as the invaders are harder to spot...gj :D [/B]

Hmmm, maybe it is a little too dark because this is not a beach map and you are not the first person to say this. I am still putting the final touches to the map so maybe one of the next compiles I'll notch up the brightness +5. I am not saying this is going to be final, but I am still searching for the perfect lighting in this map in order to please as many people as possible.

Anyways I am having a little trouble getting the class limits to work. Here is the .cfg: Basically I want no snipers on both sides, 2 allied mgs, and 4 german mgs. Would these be the right settings because when I go in game I can still select sniper.
//Allies

mp_limitallieslight 8

mp_limitalliesassault 15

mp_limitalliesheavy 25

mp_limitalliessniper 0

mp_limitalliesmg 2

//Axis

mp_limitaxislight 4

mp_limitaxisassault 10

mp_limitaxisheavy 20

mp_limitaxissniper 0

mp_limitaxismg 4

Thanks guys keep the replies coming.

Well. Mr Binary :p, I won't litter map's thread with discussion with you. Just one advice - when you coming to these forums switch off your "Daddy says, kids listen" mode.
PS. in Multiplayer game depends on me only ? Errm, what ? You had probably played with bots only :-\.

Originally posted by Craftos
Well. Mr Binary :p, I won't litter map's thread with discussion with you. Just one advice - when you coming to these forums switch off your "Daddy says, kids listen" mode.
PS. in Multiplayer game depends on me only ? Errm, what ? You had probably played with bots only :-\.

That was not needed craftos, you could have at least also written something in relation to this thread... Now can someone answer my question on what is wrong with my .cfg above? Thanks.

**UPDATE**

OK my newest compile went up +5 in brightness and it was too light so I am going to try +3 or +2 and see how that goes. In the meantime here are some more pics(some I took during 3.1 but the areas haven't really changed):

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_finalcompile10004.JPG

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_finalcompile10005.JPG


http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_entitystuff0000.JPG

http://www.freewebs.com/mexikilla/B2J_dod_akte0007.JPG

Even if it's that dark, doesn't matter. When you shoot any gun in DoD you basically turn on a flashlight. The dark might work for a disadvantage....which I would be looking forward to.

Looking good, awaiting release.

Mexikilla, my thoughts on your .cfg file is that there needs to be way more light infantry. Yeah, I know there's all this talk about "The Kar's too powerful" and "The Garand sucks," but the light infantry was the bread and butter of both armies.

Also concerning gameplay, rifles are better suited to the open field and will also do well inside the buildings. I know that the heavy infantry will also do well at this, but it's just weird to me to have more heavy and medium infantry than light.

Originally posted by Draft Dodger
Mexikilla, my thoughts on your .cfg file is that there needs to be way more light infantry. Yeah, I know there's all this talk about "The Kar's too powerful" and "The Garand sucks," but the light infantry was the bread and butter of both armies.

Also concerning gameplay, rifles are better suited to the open field and will also do well inside the buildings. I know that the heavy infantry will also do well at this, but it's just weird to me to have more heavy and medium infantry than light.

Draft Dodger I am a little confused how the .cfg works. For example, since the limitallieslight is set to 8 that means that the server will only allow 8 garands on the US side right? If this is right then why can I still select sniper when I have put the limit at 0? Thanks.

Speaking of the class limits, I just copied the one from the mapping FAQ into a new .cfg but I added the mgs and changed just the sniper and mg limits. I guess I should change the other classes too but I just want to understand how the numbers work first. Thanks, I got a few more things to do but I'd like to release this thing tonight because its D-day ;)

EDIT: Alright I found this page http://www.tla-projects.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/dod/limits.html and I guess that 1.0 still has these bugs. I will edit my .cfg and see if this works.

EDIT: That didn't work either... I can still select every class. Maybe the they changed it in 1.0 so I have to put a //US in front of allies or something? Or maybe since the class names are different in 1.0 I have to actually write the gun like the para class limits. I am stumped... Anybody know of any change in the 1.0 .cfg?

ok the .cfg has obviously changed because dod execs my .cfg it just doesn't recognize the commands in 1.0.



I need to know the new cvars.

Craftos,

Sorry if I came across in too negative a manner.

That's a problem with chat boards and international boundries... simple discussions and their meanings can be mis-interpreted sometimes.

I meant no disrespect or hard fealings. Cheers mate! :)

Mr. Binary

Mexikilla,

I think you are right, those commands don't seem to work any longer. At least not at the moment anyway.

Maybe the dod crew has some plans for those files in a future patch.

Mr. Binary

nj..

I'm making the readme. Who made uetz.wad? I know his name is uetz something but I can't remember...

the map looks really great and i think the lighting should be as in the first pics you posted, nightmaps are fun..(trying to think on dod_seg3 by night.. shoud be fun :D)

and i think you need to have mp_limitaxismp40 and the weapon names instead of classes in 1.0..

great job!
awaiting release..