dod_strand_b4

***DOWNLOAD LINK REMOVED. Go HERE for the latest version (rc1) (http://dayofdefeat.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=69774)

It's finally ready for release! dod_strand is a faithful source conversion of the original dod map, dod_charlie. It's the same map you used to know and love (or absolutely hated). dod_strand is a large detonation map with four objectives.

Prepare to storm the beach (or alternatively, to fight off the invaders)!
Beach 1 (http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/9351/strandpic6dv3.jpg)
Beach 2 (http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/5133/strandpic5fe9.jpg)
Beach 3 (http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/5087/strandpic4bo0.jpg)
Trenches 1 (http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/6817/strandpic8lc3.jpg)
Trenches 2 (http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/8595/strandpic2tk4.jpg)
Left flak 18 (http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/2969/strandpic7wg0.jpg)
Right flak18 (http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/6500/strandpic1wu3.jpg)
Overview (http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/24/dodstrandoverview2vr3.jpg)

Flak18 model by Ranson
Mortar and 150mm Big Gun model by TheSurgeon
Cow model by pedroleum
Sky texture by silentsteps
Bunkbed models and trench textures by Waldo
German posters by rascal

WIP Thread (http://dayofdefeat.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=65490)

Thanks to the community for all the comments/help/suggestions!
Huge thanks to http://www.dod-federation.com/ for being the greatest mapping resource ever!

Changelog:
changes in b4 (9/22/06)
-time shortened
-flak18 changed to 2 flag
-axis spawn system changed
-scoring fixed
-destroying flak guns lessens the beach bombing
-rear bunker redone and 150mm model added

4/26/06 - map started

***DOWNLOAD LINKS REMOVED***
Go get the newest version instead! (http://dayofdefeat.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=69774)

(if you absolutely HAVE to have b4, click here (http://diamond.dod-federation.com/dod_strand_b4.zip))

Extract the file to your dod\maps folder.
Your folder structure should be like this (or similar):
C:\Program Files\Valve\Steam\SteamApps\username\day of defeat source\dod\maps\

*stops mapcompile to play this*

Nifty, ill give it a try

wow, very nicely done! i love the little details everywhere. like the plan near the antenna objective or that amazing cliff in the back of the map :)

i hope to see a server up sometime soon!

Originally posted by pedroleum
...like the plan near the antenna objective...
That's a tribute to the old dod_charlie :). That's the old overview, after all.

omfg, u dont know how long i have been waiting for a good charlie remake. dustin, you ARE the man.

it will be running on my clan server.

208.167.224.30:27015

Map of the year!

The new siren feature is really nice.

Everything looks like the old classic.

Can you putting netting on the framed portion of the axis bunker? Refer to the top of this picture:

http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/8595/strandpic2tk4.jpg

OHH yeah its out!! I'll be having it on my server most of the night!!! Great Job Dustin!!!

8.9.36.168:27015 -|HOTT|- HOME OF THE TESTICLE *Recruiting*

One word...


Sweeeeeeet !!!

This map is mint, great work Dustin ! Looking forward to playing on a full server. Hurry up admins !!

:)

looks very nice, excellent work! :)

Running here in approx 15 mins from now :

195.20.109.87:27015

UK server, 32 player, fast downloads, very high spec ;)

HH's servers are all setup for a great weekend on strand.

Come check us out!!!

Seattle, WA:

Stalag 13
66.150.164.117:27015

Los Angeles, CA:

Stalag 17
66.150.155.123:27015

Absolutly amazing.

My new favorite map! In fact, I loved it so much I made a server dedicated to it.

Running 24/7:

64.27.6.88:27016 Trench Foot Two 24/7 STRAND - WDFNews.com

On the 28th's Pub server

IP in my sig

huzzah!!

here's a mirror for great justice

move zig (http://www.jparlay.com/dod_strand_b4.rar)

Seems very true to dod_charlie, not one of my favorite maps of all time but big ups for keeping true to it

Hope to see a 3d skybox in the final release

I also sugguest maybe putting a func_occluder in the bluff bend to clip off those models being rendered in the back from the beach

love the map

a few very minor things:

1) There seems to be (at least) 1 puff of black smoke above the beach that never goes away (like something exploding over and over ?!?)

2) you should give name to the beach (and maybe other parts of the map). when typing %l it says TODO: name this
:D

other than that, it looks really good

being played on the [-Q-] custom map server:

[-Q-] Custom Map Server w/ FF On [100 Tick]: 209.160.36.97:27015

Originally posted by Someth|ngW|cked
Hope to see a 3d skybox in the final release

I also sugguest maybe putting a func_occluder in the bluff bend to clip off those models being rendered in the back from the beach

lol, you might not be able to tell, but the 3d skybox is actually there...Granted, the water could go much futher back. I'll try extending it and see what the fps hit is like.

And there is an occluder in the ridge line. The only problem is the break in the ridge at the location of the mg nest/sandbags. Optimization was a total beast with this, but I started at the very beginning adding things with it in mind, so it seems to run pretty well. 70+ for me on a server with 24.

Thanks for the comments. I could use some more constructive suggestions like this.

Originally posted by Beta~Thanatos

1) There seems to be (at least) 1 puff of black smoke above the beach that never goes away (like something exploding over and over ?!?)

2) you should give name to the beach (and maybe other parts of the map). when typing %l it says TODO: name this


1) could you screenshot this for me? I cant seem to find it. The only smoke on the beach is coming from the closest busted tank

2) haha, I totally forgot about that. I'll make sure to add the location names in for the next version.

Thanks!

8.2.121.123:27015
[TL] ThatsLife: Source |Strand_b4 (Charlie) fastdownload


I got the map on it, and will stay here for atleast 24hours

If other mappers need testers just email me

admin@thats-life.be

Steve

PS: good map/good remake

and 6 min, is not to long, and not to short. Its tough to win with this timer

Great job Dustin. I've always been a huge fan of Charlie. VERY, VERY well done. I wish I would have playtested this one over at the Federation. Sorry I missed it. Now that I've played it some..just a couple things I thought may help.

1. It seems to bright. Make it a bit gloomier. It was heavily overcast on D-Day and I see youve gone for that, but it still seems like the sun is out. Just darken it a tad. You've done the fog well, I'm just referring to overall brightness on the whole map.

2. Ambience. You need some planes flying overhead. That would add a lot. Also, when they fly over have them drop heavier bombs on the beach. You could even have this Axis controlled. i.e. smallhill. I know this makes it harder on allies, but getting off the beach has always been half the challenge & half the fun. The ambience in Charlie was created by it's own sound files (guys yelling incoming, etc.), so I know recreating that may be difficult. Once they are off the beach, the map is fairly spread out, so its not that hard to cap out if you're worried about no one ever getting of the beach head.

3. Mortars. Increase there sound when they land on the beach. I just dont feel as immersed as I did in Charlie. This is probably a combination of 1 and 2 though. I ran up the beach 20 times and never once was under a concussion..that should happen more often.

Other then that, it rocks and thank-you!

For God's sake do not make it gloomier. It is perfect. People always forget that all monitors are NOT the same, and the magic "gamma" button does not work as well as you think on a darker monitor.

There were no planes on D-Day. Bad weather in England. Anyway he was going for a re-creation; not a re-imagining.

The mystical puff of smoke keeps appearing high above the middle destructable bunker. I saw it too, thought it was kinda odd looked just like flak going off in the sky. It may very well be misplaced smokepuffs from bullet hits.

This is quite simply as stunningly perfect re-creation of Charlie. And I do really mean stunning. I played this map for 2 hours straight tonight, and aside from VERY minor details (couple of rock walls instead of bushes, etc) there were times I almost forgot I was playing a custom map and that charlie ISN'T a stock map :D (yes it is that true to the original.) Sizes dimensions, distances - everything. Though obviously you didn't create this map, you did do something almost as hard; an inch by inch replica.

Originally posted by Wile E Coyote
For God's sake do not make it gloomier. It is perfect. People always forget that all monitors are NOT the same, and the magic "gamma" button does not work as well as you think on a darker monitor.

There were no planes on D-Day. Bad weather in England. Anyway he was going for a re-creation; not a re-imagining.


Maybe I have a bright monitor then. For me it, looks like it's Noon. My gamma is neutral and would never even consider turning it up. Ok..so use 88's for the shelling on the beach. I'm just giving suggestions to create some immersion ambience. The beach just doesnt seem that chaotic.

Was in two games today. Both times team wins were close to even (except the scores were <3<3<3<3ed with allies at 0).

In terms of atmosphere I totally see what people are talking about... I can't put my finger on what it is that makes the lighting not perfect... it looks good, but not perfect and I don't think brightness/darkness is necessarily the answer. Perhaps more saturation to the brightness and ambience... or more accurate colors all togather. The textures seem very "true" and unaffected by atmosphere.

Also the beach could manage to be a bit louder and more epic... but that too is difficult to come to an easy solution. You've really done all the necessities to the map. It's serious fun.

Originally posted by Dustin Diamond
1) could you screenshot this for me? I cant seem to find it. The only smoke on the beach is coming from the closest busted tank

2) haha, I totally forgot about that. I'll make sure to add the location names in for the next version.

Thanks!

1) well the second time around it wasn't there...so maybe it was me...I'll keep looking for it....

i think many in the dods-scene will pray from now to you :D

charlie was a map, many hated but they loved to play it :D (could also be called masochism)

should run on WQ1 in the next few minutes (upload takes a little bit :D)

Had a very enjoyable game last night, captures charlies essence very well.

Just one observation, the sky box seems rather low on the beach. When on axis in the central mortar position I could bounce my rpg shell off the skybox to take out the snipers I did not have line of sight on :)

I suppose this is done for performance and to optimise fps, would be nice if it was just a bit higher imho.

Look forward to an overview in the next release, but so far it looks amazing, good job! :)

Dustin, your map f'ing rules.

I'm guessing in a week it will be #1 on the war report.

Originally posted by nave

Also the beach could manage to be a bit louder and more epic... but that too is difficult to come to an easy solution. You've really done all the necessities to the map. It's serious fun.

You summed up what I was trying to say all along. Well done. The original Charlie did this. Maybe it was just there hokey ambience..but something on the beach for immersion is just missing. The map Rocks..it's awesome..I love it..its just the one thing..and IMO, its a big thing. You want to feel like you're there..epic is a perfect word.

Giant work ! It will be a pleasure to play on this well-known old map, you put in it a real new ambiance, thx for your work and all the time you have spend on it !!

One thing: i have seen the helmet but where is the fg42 :D (i know, i know ..)

it was running now on WQ1 with full-server (32 players) - after a few minutes the people asked already if i could extend the map-time.

most of them loved the map, some of them hated the map but still stayed on the server :D (not important if you love or hate it - you play it :D)

just one was on the server claiming about so many bugs in the map but i think he was just a noob who tried to cover his low skill with non-existing bugs (he could never tell me where some bug is - he was just flaiming around and joins then my ban-list :D)

the map looks also good balanced - i think we had 3:3 wins - i use 2 MGs and 2 Snipers on each side.

just one question - the explosions on the beach come from the 2 flack's - right? why is there still fire when they have been destroyed?

Congrats Dustin :) It was fun testing it on our server.

Download Mirror (http://qorclan.com/clan01/vwar/downloads.php?action=details&dlid=41)

Playing at Sunlits
Great fps and drop dead gorgeous.

Originally posted by ShootMe
just one question - the explosions on the beach come from the 2 flack's - right? why is there still fire when they have been destroyed?

yay! A full 32 server!

When the flaks are destroyed, the beach bombing lessens. I didnt want to completely remove the bombings as then it would be easy as pie for allies to get off the beach. Anyone else have opinions about this? should i change it?

Also, are the bombings frequent enough? I felt like i was hit my mortars more than enough times, but some people seem to scoot by without getting touched...

maybe that the Flak's has to be fired personally from the axis? then some of them couldn't defent the front, but on the other side the Flak's are defended then.

the bombing on the beach is ok, i was just wondering where it comes from after the gun's are down ;) - maybe some planes which bomb the beach like in dod_smallhill?

and playing it on full 32 server was great - on the beach you had a good chance to get killed before you reach the base but that makes it interessting :D

i don't remember if it was this case in the original dod_charlie but there are just bombs at the beach and if you die with bomb, no one else could pic it up - maybe make some (hard reachable) bomb depot inside axis base? make directly at their middle frontline?

very very very good remake!!!!

some suggestions:

- i noticed a player got under the map somehow and was sniping from way under the water, can u fix that?

- make the skybox and sand darker?

- add netting to the radio, like in original charlie

- perhaps increase timer gain from 30 sec. to a minute when allies destroy an objective?

- sniper limit?

Originally posted by ic0n612


- sniper limit?

thats easy to limit with mani for example - i think it's not good (if anyhow possible) to limit it directly in the map. maybe someone would use the map as sniper map.

i limit it for 2 snipers on each side - thats ok for 32 slot server - on smaller servers maybe a limit to 1 sniper could be better.

looks awsome and everyone is giving you great feedback im uploading it now to our server good job.

Originally posted by ic0n612
very very very good remake!!!!

some suggestions:

- i noticed a player got under the map somehow and was sniping from way under the water, can u fix that?

- make the skybox and sand darker?

- add netting to the radio, like in original charlie

- perhaps increase timer gain from 30 sec. to a minute when allies destroy an objective?



Great suggestions for a great map.

people seem to be having issues with the short time.

I'd really like some suggestions as how to change the time. That was the one thing i couldnt really test on my own.

Should the initial time be changed? or just the cap times?

Currently it's 6:30 at the start plus 30 sec for the single caps, and 45 for the double.

In the initial playtest I had, it was 7 minutes total and 1 minutes for each cap, but the flaks were only 1 bomb. That proved to be waaaaay too long, as axis would be defending the last flag for 3-4 minutes.

I need your suggestions!! What would be the best way to change the time?

IMO:

The radio at the allies radio tower should be used to call in air strikes as featured in dod_smallhill.

I also agree with another individual that thought of having players initiate the firing of the Flak88 cannons.

These two changes would enhance the teamwork potential on the axis side.

Did you ever think to have the last big gun fire? Maybe have it fired on a time scale that is five times longer than the Flak88's but has a blast radius that is several times larger? This could maybe entice a few axis players to actually guard and operate the rear detonation zone.

Wooohooo!! I've been waiting a while for this one.

honestly, I wouldn;t change the timer at all....

the fact that it's a short timer makes it a fast paced map and I played it a few times already and the allies had not trouble winning when they really tried.

adding more time would make the map worse in my opinion.

Originally posted by Dustin Diamond
people seem to be having issues with the short time.

I'd really like some suggestions as how to change the time. That was the one thing i couldnt really test on my own.

Should the initial time be changed? or just the cap times?

Currently it's 6:30 at the start plus 30 sec for the single caps, and 45 for the double.

In the initial playtest I had, it was 7 minutes total and 1 minutes for each cap, but the flaks were only 1 bomb. That proved to be waaaaay too long, as axis would be defending the last flag for 3-4 minutes.

I need your suggestions!! What would be the best way to change the time?

the time was not that big problem but it was sometimes hard because the bombs are just at beach - maybe raise time to 45/60 seconds or put somewhere in axis base a bomb-depot - this would help too

Timer settings are good imo, allies had no trouble winning when they used teamwork.

As for lighting etc, it's great. No need to change it at all imo.

Only visual glitchs I noticed were the real world/skybox water transition, I noticed a color change. There were some other small texture alignment issues on the top side of the trench walls (textures needing to be turned 90 degrees).

Very fun map, I played it for a few hours last night, good times.

:)

I just got finished playing it on my server (we only topped out at 14 so it wasn't the best test).

The only issue I encountered was on axis when I got stuck in the sliding door out of the bunker spawn... perm stuck.

Originally posted by ultranew_b
Only visual glitchs I noticed were the real world/skybox water transition, I noticed a color change.
Can you screenshot this? i worked for a while to fix this and I thought i had it right. i can't see the transition as long as i'm not spectator and flying around. I even made a new water vmt to combat this problem. It exists in the stock maps (anzio).

Don't change the timings, Dustin.

The timer is fine. Do not increase.

The lighting is fine. Do not darken.

The bombs are fine. If you hear a mortar coming in really loud - MOVE. This means it's going to drop on your head. Leave the 88's alone. Nobody needs to activate them. It's good enough as is that knocking them out reduces the amount of bombs.

Here is the ONLY suggestion I have. If it is possible, delay the start of the beach bombings by about 5 seconds at the start of the round. The map has an all too frequent tendacy to kill about 3-8 allies right at the beginning of the round, because everybody is just left the spawn and a mortar ALWAYS lands right there. I don't recall this happening on the original charlie ever, and it is downright annoying. But it is not critical at all and is not necessary to change.

To be perfectly honest people make too rapid of suggestions without playing long enough. This map pretty much plays JUST like the original Charlie - that is when there are just a few people playing, or when allies just sit on the beach not going forward the axis tend to dominate. When a large number of people join, and the allies actually get off their butt and off the beach, the tide really turns. the sheer number of targets to shoot at makes it much more difficult for the axis to get everybody, and just 2 allies in the backfield can cause a LOT of havoc, and this usually distracts the axis from shooting up the beach.

Just last night I was on a 24/7 strand server with only 3 other people on. OF COURSE one of the axis snatched the sniper slot. and of course he was shooting the 2 (and only 2) of us with relative ease. He was getting cocky too, like he had great skill or something. I flat out told him wait until more peeps join, you won't be so cocky. Sure enough as soon as we had about 18-20 people on the map, AND I convinced the allies through the mild art of persuasion to get off the beach, all sniping basically stopped. As a matter of fact old cocky boy didn't do much except die a lot, and get pissed off. (Eventually he was banned from the server for shooting teammates LOL)

This is nothing new. The map itself has been around forever. These same complaints were heard about the original Charlie. If Dustin did indeed go ahead and make the changes being suggested, there would be a new crop of complaints about how the map took too long, how hard it was to defend, how annoying it is to have teammates just sitting and firing the flak gun, etc, etc.

I think it's that kind of glitchs

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/7470/dodstrandb40000iv6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/6081/dodstrandb40003gk8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Btw i think the sandunes are a bit too small, placing tnt charges on it, is quite difficult, not impossible i know, but with the short timer it's hard:

Axis view:

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/2613/dodstrandb40004hr6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/7349/dodstrandb40005qa2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

BTW almost forgot - the "magic helmet" :D WHERE'S MY FG42???? (just kidding)

http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/4274/dodstrandb40000ua7.jpg

I actually checked to see if you put it there.

I just took a tour of the map, and I have to say, excellent job. As someone else mentioned, for a while I forgot I was in Source, it was so true to the original. However, I'm going to have to cast a vote in with the "lighting is a bit off" croud. I have a very dark monitor and I can't ever remember Charlie or any other beach map being quite so sunny feeling. I wouldn't say it's necessarily the brightness, but rather the shade of the light. A grayer value might look better.

Aside from that, outstanding work. As a Charlie fanatic of old, I will certainly be spending most of my DoD:S play time on any server running this map :)

Originally posted by Wile E Coyote
Here is the ONLY suggestion I have. If it is possible, delay the start of the beach bombings by about 5 seconds at the start of the round.
Agreed. That has been very annoying for me as well.

Also, to settle the lighting argument. The only reason that this version looks brighter is because of the brighter textures. Look, green grass! Brown dirt! Amazing! In the old version, everything was either gray or a muddied yellowish brown. While that did added to the dreary atmosphere, I dont exactly feel like editing every single texture I used. I AM going to change the skybox to make the clouds a lot darker and we'll see what that does. I'll fiddle around with the lighting slightly to see what i can do. I will NOT make it a night map, for reasons that Wile E has illustrated. Nothing is worse than being shot just because your monitor was too dark.

About the timer. I personally dont think it's too short. But people have been whining. My goal was to get people off the dang beach. If you want to sit on the beach and snipe the whole time, enjoy losing. If the allied team wants to win, then get off the dang beach. Currently, blowing the shingle moves the axis spawns back from the ridge into the bunkers, so there is a great benefit to blowing that shingle fast.

When I played on Friday for 2+ hours, the final score was 14-14. What kinds of scores have you guys been seeing?

when i played it last night, the allies always lost :P ahh well, although personally i would say give the allies more time when they blow something up. say like 1 min or 2. cause 30 seconds etc doesnt really add much of an effect. :)

Originally posted by Dustin Diamond
Agreed. That has been very annoying for me as well.

Also, to settle the lighting argument. The only reason that this version looks brighter is because of the brighter textures. Look, green grass! Brown dirt! Amazing! In the old version, everything was either gray or a muddied yellowish brown. While that did added to the dreary atmosphere, I dont exactly feel like editing every single texture I used. I AM going to change the skybox to make the clouds a lot darker and we'll see what that does. I'll fiddle around with the lighting slightly to see what i can do. I will NOT make it a night map, for reasons that Wile E has illustrated. Nothing is worse than being shot just because your monitor was too dark.

About the timer. I personally dont think it's too short. But people have been whining. My goal was to get people off the dang beach. If you want to sit on the beach and snipe the whole time, enjoy losing. If the allied team wants to win, then get off the dang beach. Currently, blowing the shingle moves the axis spawns back from the ridge into the bunkers, so there is a great benefit to blowing that shingle fast.

When I played on Friday for 2+ hours, the final score was 14-14. What kinds of scores have you guys been seeing?

yes, please make it more cloudy/darker. doesnt need to be anight map though.

fixing the arty would be nice too. it kept taking me out at the begining of the round.

ive seen the scores fluctuate... sometimes the allies kept winning round after round, sometimes they kept losing.

I've seen fairly even scores the times I've played so far with the caveat that the Allies have to get their act together and move off the beach ASAP.

But then that's what beach landings are all about!

Changes I've noticed are the new axis spawn exit, the redesigned tunnels and BG (like it), the fact the Germans can't leap over the centre position to the shingle, the missing crack in the right blowable wall. Oh yes and the exploding teller mines (nice!)

Lighting is neither here nor there for me personally I can live with as is or accept any changes made. I did get stuck a couple of times on the sides of the trench wall. Turning right as allies towards the radio tower, the left side of the trench snagged me where it kinks. Frame rate was good and no super lags for this soldier.

As to the timing, it's tight but doable. Just have to use that magic teamwork.

Great map and one I'll be looking for when I login!

I've been playing this more and more. I just dont feel like I'm being hammered on the beach as an allie. I dont know if you want to increase the rate of fire of the 88's or make there blast radius further out or what. Also, if I remember correctly, there were craters that would be blown up on the beach in certain places in charlie. I'm not sure if you have that in there or not, but that could be a nice additive.

I know it's not historically accurate, but I still like the idea of having the radio tower be able to call in a bombing strike like in smallhill. This would give it more ambience.

I love the map, it just feels like its missing ambience on the beach. Is there any way to have the allies yell..incoming! when the 88's are fired? Also, maybe more smoke from the tanks? I think it's little things like that are missing.

Keep up the good work.

I have won a LOT as the allies. I will say this though - we NEVER have won yet with more than 2 minutes left to go on the timer. So I can understand the unrest about the time. However I like it, there have been more last minute wins by the allies than I can shake a stick at. Very nail-biting. LOL remember that if the last bomb is planted the level doesn't end when the timer runs out. I made that mistake on axis :)

The beach storming was much more difficult in charlie. But I've never been in game after game of extremely close fights. I typically don't say "gg", but I actually gave in - I pretty much had to. Making these types of changes could work out, but as much as I hate the phrase, "if it's not broke, don't fix it"... it sounds too much like this case.

Though I think the ambience itself on the beach could be intensified, I don't think it needs to be affecting gameplay.... at all.

I finally got to play this with real people and I must say, it's alot of fun. I haven't played enough of it to make suggestions though.:)

This map is great, feels pretty much exactly like good ole Charlie, it's great. I could stand for the sky being a bit darker and gloomier, but overall the brightness of the map is fine. Also, are you planning on adding the camo netting over the trenches and around the radio tower?

Solid FPS, looks beautiful, on a full 32 man server it's amazing. Thanks for all the hard work!

Originally posted by Fr3t
I think it's that kind of glitchs

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/7470/dodstrandb40000iv6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/6081/dodstrandb40003gk8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Btw i think the sandunes are a bit too small, placing tnt charges on it, is quite difficult, not impossible i know, but with the short timer it's hard:


Hmm. The funny thing is, the water doesnt look like that on mine. On my end, the skybox water blends perfectly (proof (http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/4056/dodstrandb40000ir4.jpg)). can you please tell me your video settings (resolutions, quality, etc)? I'm trying to replicate this but i cant. Is everyone else seeing the bad transition that Fr3t sees?

And about the dunes. Allies can plant from nearly 64 units away, which is a long distance. You dont have to be right up on the glowing marker, which is the mistake many make. Start hitting E the entire time you are crawling up that incline. Regardless, i do plan on remaking the blowable sections, since they look totally flat and out of place...

I got a chance to play with you tonight on my server. Listen, these guys can say what they want about the time, but I played for four hours tonight spending equal time on both sides and with a bit of teamwork managed to win equal times.

The lighting is perfect. Any darker and I fear the allies wouldn't have a chance against axis snipers (Can barely see them from a distance as is).

The dunes are perfect.

The key to success in this map is the ability to garand snipe on your way up the beach.

Please, just fix the bugs and add one more loop of the siren :p



Oh, and Caen is a good idea :D

Also, to settle the lighting argument. The only reason that this version looks brighter is because of the brighter textures. Look, green grass! Brown dirt! Amazing! In the old version, everything was either gray or a muddied yellowish brown. While that did added to the dreary atmosphere, I dont exactly feel like editing every single texture I used. I AM going to change the skybox to make the clouds a lot darker and we'll see what that does. I'll fiddle around with the lighting slightly to see what i can do.
Lighting is good just the way it is :)
The fog over the top of the bunkers makes it imperative for the allies to move up and IS the axis... nice incentive.
Ive seen the axis and the allies roll the map depending on team makeup.
Dustin : would you please give an official explanation of the scoring ? Thanks.

Originally posted by RosietheRiveter
Dustin : would you please give an official explanation of the scoring ? Thanks.

It's exactly the same as Jagd, only backwards (since axis defends).

fun little map, Iron Sights are actually very useful.

charlie perfection achieved

This is an awesome conversion of dod_Charlie to Source. How about porting over some of the other 1.3 maps? Caen2 and Jagd would be sweet.

Originally posted by DarkNoble
fun little map, Iron Sights are actually very useful.

I was thinking the exact same thing. For the first time ever in DoD I was using the iron sights constantly!

This map is running on our server like crazy, with both sides winning when the Allied play AS A TEAM....Well Done!

Very nicely done, thanks a bunch!

very nice map.

quick question for you.

have you thought of doing a tank version of the map.
add some more tank obsticles and have the allies trying to clear the beach of obsticles with bombs so a tank can move up the beach and break the shingle.

or just have it as a kind of sub game where if u move up the tank it makes "another way into the bunker" by blasting a wall etc.

plus i would love some rocket targets! :-p

This may sound dopey but the original Charlie was the map that made me fall in love with DoD.

I dips me lid to you.

Thankyou :)

Originally posted by caboose

have you thought of doing a tank version of the map.
add some more tank obsticles and have the allies trying to clear the beach of obsticles with bombs so a tank can move up the beach and break the shingle.

While I won't do this in dod_strand, this is a great idea for a different beach map! I think strand is just a bit too big to implement this effectively. A different layout with this same idea would be stellar. I'll keep this in mind when i start my next project.

Well, after getting all excited about it just reading these threads at work, I finally got to play Strand.

Your map is amazing, but don't take my word for it.

When I signed on to steam, there were more people playing your map than friggin' jagd or colmar. Not more servers... more people in servers playing actually playing it. These were serves from all across the world.

I guess as a community we've really been wanting a beach map. And Strand couldn't be a better present.

Sure would be nice if someone could correct the mappers name on that Stats page :)

Cuz we know who made it! ! ! :)


http://www.dayofdefeat.com/stats/maps.html

Originally posted by Cranbarry
Sure would be nice if someone could correct the mappers name on that Stats page :)

Cuz we know who made it! ! ! :)


http://www.dayofdefeat.com/stats/maps.html

Someone has got to PM PIU for that to change.

Originally posted by Cranbarry
Sure would be nice if someone could correct the mappers name on that Stats page :)
Cuz we know who made it! ! ! :)
http://www.dayofdefeat.com/stats/maps.html
My jaw nearly hit the floor. Good grief, it's not that good, people! Or maybe i'm just numb to it from staring at the dang Hammer screen for the last 5 months.

It took less than 4.5 days to get listed on the stats page!! All the thanks for that goes to you guys!! Hell, I've probably only gotten to play it less than 3 hours since I released it last Friday. I've been too busy with grad school. So you guys must have been loving it up! Thanks again!

I've got a long list of changes/tweaks to implement before the next beta, but that probably won't be too far off. Maybe a week or two. The stats clearly show the Allies are getting hammered, which is sort of exactly what I wanted :). No teamwork = no wins. Plus, if the server isnt full, it's just a turkey shoot for the axis. Easy as pie.

Originally posted by deceiver
Someone has got to PM PIU for that to change.
I just did it. thanks for the tip

Originally posted by Dustin Diamond
The stats clearly show the Allies are getting hammered Yes, that's pretty much what happened on the old charlie too, for the exact reasons you mentioned above

I'm sure the balance will be much better in a couple weeks, when people get familiar with the layout and realize teamwork is required. It's still very new. I was lost for the first few hours as well.

:)

I played it in a reasonably full server earlier for about two hours. I have a few observations I want to relate.

Snipers should probably be turned off, server-side. The Garand from the beach easily takes out MG's and anyone poking their head up from the berm. The snipers on my team (allied) fulfilled their traditional role: prone, on the beach, getting blown up by mortars and going 5-60. Axis snipers hid in the bunkers and got knifed when they weren't killing anyone who got past the seawall.

To make it even remotely possible to MG from the bunkers, I would consider putting the netting all the way around the front. You won't be able to see as well, but you'd be able to fire more than 30 rounds before getting zapped by a rifleman from the beach.

The clock is an issue. It's really my only major gripe at all. With decent (read: decent for a random pub) teamwork and a really hard push, we were able to cap out the radio and the 88's by six minute's end. Had anyone taken my advice from COUNTLESS hours played in Earlzytown's 24/7 Charlie No Sniper server and gone for the coastal gun first, this might not have been quite as much of an issue. However, this is not what happened, so we got spanked every single round. The allies on a beach map are supposed to get slaughtered and lose every time if they don't work together, yes. However, the point is they have to work together to get off the beach and the Germans have to try to work to keep them there. I found it easy to play as a German on this map and not feel any major pressure to defend because I knew there was no way in hell the other team could cap everything out in six minutes and they never did.

I saw lots of Garands being carried up the beach, getting tossed through the air from explosions, and taking out MG's and snipers from the shoreline. This pleases me greatly to see a map come out in Source that greatly rewards the use of this weapon and discourages the use of the Thompson.

Bazookas from the bunkers... still not sure how I feel about that one. A beach map without access to the M1 carbine feels ridiculously wrong to me, yet bazookas on Charlie feels equally wrong. With any luck, perhaps some day the devs will make the carbine it's own class again and give the bazooka class an M3 instead. This would be ideal because then server ops could disable the bazooka class altogether on this map and things would play perfectly without having to lose access to the carbine. :D

The look and feel of the map is just superb. Waldo's design lives up to today's standards and Dustin's work in translating it to such is something that was badly needed in this community I think. I guess to make a comparison, the old Charlie felt like an old documentary film, and the Source port feels more like actually being there. Coming through the left break in the seawall and looking over and seeing smooth sand dunes built up against a rock wall and then transitioning to grass textures really sticks in my mind as making more visual sense than the original.

Originally posted by ultranew_b
I'm sure the balance will be much better in a couple weeks, when people get familiar with the layout and realize teamwork is required. It's still very new. I was lost for the first few hours as well.

:) on Charlie?????

Man, you really ARE ultra-new! :D

My jaw nearly hit the floor. Good grief, it's not that good, people!
Pish Tosh
It IS that good and a long time in coming.
We all have favourite beach maps but Charlie was the rule by which the others were measured.

Beach maps and det maps.
Can advancing spawns and objectives ( pretty please the enigma machine on Revolted or the gas can on hameau ) be far behind?

This map to me is what I love best about pubbing dod. it feels like ww2 it demands teamwork and something more than pure death match.

I find it plays even better than the original.


I don't think the costal gun is quite as important as the old days....now that it blows up in 1. the 88s are actually tactically more important as if well defended the fact that you need to place 2 charges makes them a bear to take. You can easily lock down the hallway on the cow gun and cover the rear or just the elevator and become impregnable.

a good sniper on the other 88 and some autos covering the back approach make winning for the allies very tough. The costal gun and the radio are quick 30 sec extenders is the way I look at it.

Great work diamond

I have to agree with Krust's post on the change in importance of the objectives from the old Charlie. Besides providing a good use for iron sights, I also appreciate a well placed rifle grenade. Loved seeing one sail into the bunker slit and an Axis mg'er sail out.

After s'more playing, I too find the timer a bit short for the Allies. Perhaps with a 1 minute increase instead of a 30-second increase for the radio tower/big gun, the Allies would have a fairer chance. As it stands though, the Allies do have a fighting chance, if they're able to get their act together.

Probably the most satisfying map I've played for the Garand. Popping off ISed shots at MGs and snipers is great fun, and I'm getting a lot better at firing off my rifle grenade at long distances.

Only problem is that I don't have a full Carbine or Greasegun to storm the beach with, but then there's not much you can do about that Dustin. :p

Originally posted by Dustin Diamond
Hmm. The funny thing is, the water doesnt look like that on mine. On my end, the skybox water blends perfectly (proof (http://img208.imageshack.us/img208/4056/dodstrandb40000ir4.jpg)). can you please tell me your video settings (resolutions, quality, etc)? I'm trying to replicate this but i cant. Is everyone else seeing the bad transition that Fr3t sees?

And about the dunes. Allies can plant from nearly 64 units away, which is a long distance. You dont have to be right up on the glowing marker, which is the mistake many make. Start hitting E the entire time you are crawling up that incline. Regardless, i do plan on remaking the blowable sections, since they look totally flat and out of place...

1: ati radeon 9250 SE :eek: cpu 1.9ghz, ram 512, don't laugh please ;)

2: Planting is not so hard thx !

Man no words for this, this map is so awsome!
To bad I don't see much servers playing this map.
It has a real D-Day feel.

Also it has been done very professional.
Very much details, and interactive objects.

This is much better than the default maps!
Finally some open space.

Keep up the good work man!!

Originally posted by straybullet Perhaps with a 1 minute increase instead of a 30-second increase for the radio tower/big gun[/B] This may very well be the best compromise. If the allies just sit on their butts and don't do anything, the level is not drawn out uselessly. However, between the 2 that added extra 60 seconds would probably be more than enough to satisfy most, and yet still provide for the crowd that wishes the allies to actually have to fight for any advantage.

Okay, this is my second suggestion for the map; adopt straybullet's idea ;)

Fantastic.

I agree that the time is too short. I've finally had a chance to play on several servers in full games. It definitely will change.

Yes, allies CAN win if they work as a team, but I feel that even when the allies are working effectively, it's still a mad rush to complete all objectives. I dont want it to be this way. I think you should still have a chance to breath, instead of just mindlessly rushing all of the flags, which is basically the strategy required in this version. I know some of you may be annoyed with the longer times, with the argument that short times force teamwork. Sure, if allies work as a team they can win, BUT if axis just barely shows any teamwork, they will completely dominate. An axis team that shows a LOT of teamwork will be unstoppable. 6 minutes (plus 1:30, maybe) is a joke as it is.

No, i do not want it to be 50/50 wins, as I feel it should be harder for allies. However, i do want it to be fun to play. And to be fun, i feel that allies should still have the hope of winning, which currently isnt happening. Plus, i play exclusively on pubs, so it has to be fun for a hodgepodge of random players to play.

(random side note: in 1 day, this map was played 10000 more hours minutes! hells yeah! http://www.dayofdefeat.com/stats/maps.html)

Edit: I'm an idiot.

I believe you mean minutes. :)

Two things that I would be interested to see on this map: a slightly darker, gloomier sky, and perhaps a bit more cover on the beach.

I'm not talking about a great deal of cover, but maybe another tank and maybe a few crates here and there. That would allow the Allies to move up methodically, and hopefully put the kabbash on excessive camping from the Americans.

This map is great, and whenever my server is full, I try to switch to it.

_____________________

Originally posted by Dustin Diamond
I agree that the time is too short. I've finally had a chance to play on several servers in full games. It definitely will change.....

This is very positive as many of us have this same attitude. Even 4 min added on would be a positive step. Thanks again for a very popular map. :)

Boy I dunno about 4 extra minutes.... but then again, I just came out of a game where the allies were playing smart and hard...

Maybe 2 - 2:30 extra minutes?

I really think the time shouldn't be modified - and if it is, it shouldn't be more than 1 extra minute added.
Adding more time than that would really make this map too easy for the US to win....

Teamwork shouldnt just apply to allies. The axis team should have to use teamwork as well to show a strong defense. An unorganzied axis team will probably lose, just like every other map. Who knows. The only way to test it is to make small adjustments and see what happens...

Running on our server !

Yea... I wouldn't have wanted the timer to be changed because whenever I played as an Ally I was in extreme teamwork mode and having super fun (also in servers with limited snipers and MGs). But the war report posts a more grim image...

dod_strand_b4 50,788
Allies Axis
29.13% 70.87%
(712) (1,732)
Mapper Unknown

First off, we do know who the mapper is. And yea... 30:70 is pretty intense. It could use some balancing.

In my opinion, it could be more affective to increase the bonus times rather than the start time. Because if the allied team hasn't got ANY objectives in the first X amount of minutes, a bonus isn't going to help them unless their team all of a sudden snaps into it out of nowhere.

Right now the bonus times are 30 and 45 right? Maybe 45 and 1:00?

I'd consider just increasing the bonus time as well. This would force the allies to complete at least one objective before time runs out. If you did it this way, I would recommend 1 or even 2 minutes per blown objective.

Looking forward to the next update.

Amount of total time to add / (number of objectives - 1) = Amount of bonus time to add per objective

2 minutes per objective would give over 5 extra minutes, which is a pretty big jump.

How about splitting the difference for beta2 and adding 1 extra minute to the round time, and 1 minute bonus per objective?

Teamwork shouldnt just apply to allies. The axis team should have to use teamwork as well to show a strong defense.
That is absolutely right. Defending teams seem to feel they just need to sit on their cans and camp the beach, with glorious medals handed to them after mowing down the invasion force.

Bullhockey. Get it together, communicate, man the mortars, pick your shots, and fall back and cover each other's backsides when it becomes necessary.

Wow. Charlie was my favourite map in DoD and Strand may very well be my favourite DoD:S map. It's incredible. I can't think of anything I would change about it. The amount of time for the allies is fine, though a lot seem to complain about not enough time. Maybe give an extra 15 secs for each time they blow up an objective if you decide you have to raise it.

Hats off Dustin good work. Running at JFG.

Ha, I just played this on a full (16v16) server. It was hectic. The allies just couldn't get of the beach for the first minute; it was amazing! Great map, Dustin Diamond.

r u the same dustin diamond from the TV series "saved by the bell"?
Were you on the Lex and Terry Show today 10/05/06?

i don't think so.. my guess is, he's either a pro wrestler or a pornstar :P

Originally posted by coldair
r u the same dustin diamond from the TV series "saved by the bell"?
Were you on the Lex and Terry Show today 10/05/06?

Haha, no, but that's where the name came from. It's not as funny anymore now that he's getting back into the spot light (or should i say, video camera light...).

My friend plays under the name "Mario Lopez" :)

still great map man was played on ower severes 3 h in a row people love it cant wait for more maps from u .

yo Double Dee could i get permission to use that radio tower in a map im workin on?
:crown:
:vader:

Played last night, and when the timer showed a "+45 seconds", we only got 30something. There's a bug somewhere, if you need a question(s) answered let me know.

I haven't played enough to really make any judgement at this point. Was fun using Ironsights tho.

Originally posted by PickItUp
Played last night, and when the timer showed a "+45 seconds", we only got 30something. There's a bug somewhere, if you need a question(s) answered let me know.


Yeah i noticed that too during my tests. I kinda just figured it started the time from the minute you plant. But now that i think about it, that cant be right either, since that would take up 25 seconds.

Is this a known bug with all maps? or just mine? Anyone noticed this with jagd or colmar?

I believe I've seen this bug on jagd and colmar but I could be mistake, the Detonation code all together for DoD:S is extremely buggy as it is (e.g. bomb failing to explode when the timer runs out and the player is still defusing).

Originally posted by LeVee [104th Inf]
(e.g. bomb failing to explode when the timer runs out and the player is still defusing).

This is intentional.

Thanks a lot for the great map, we regularly play it on our custom map server and our players love it.

Originally posted by Fr3t
I think it's that kind of glitchs

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/7470/dodstrandb40000iv6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/6081/dodstrandb40003gk8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Btw i think the sandunes are a bit too small, placing tnt charges on it, is quite difficult, not impossible i know, but with the short timer it's hard:

Axis view:

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/2613/dodstrandb40004hr6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/7349/dodstrandb40005qa2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

I got the same ''problem''. i dont know if its a bug in your [great] map or its just a problem with my video settings.... i got everything on high with 2x aa and 4x af...

http://img157.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dodstrandb40005by1.jpg

greetings
donot

I've fiddled around with the water and I'm pretty sure I have it completely fixed now, so no worries. I might be PMing some of you when i'm closer to release of the next beta so you can try it out.

Any news?

I run this map on my server, and it is very popular, the only complaints I have had are that the time is to short, it is extremely hard for allies to win, any chance of extending the round time on the next version please?

thanks for your hard work on making this map

Originally posted by nave
Yea... I wouldn't have wanted the timer to be changed because whenever I played as an Ally I was in extreme teamwork mode and having super fun (also in servers with limited snipers and MGs). But the war report posts a more grim image...

dod_strand_b4 50,788
Allies Axis
29.13% 70.87%
(712) (1,732)
Mapper Unknown

First off, we do know who the mapper is. And yea... 30:70 is pretty intense. It could use some balancing.

In my opinion, it could be more affective to increase the bonus times rather than the start time. Because if the allied team hasn't got ANY objectives in the first X amount of minutes, a bonus isn't going to help them unless their team all of a sudden snaps into it out of nowhere.

Right now the bonus times are 30 and 45 right? Maybe 45 and 1:00? I think a pretty good explanation of that win ratio is that Axis automatically wins when it comes up on a server and nobody is playing. Given that there are a decent number of servers that do the map 24/7, I think that's a thing to consider.

Originally posted by Bisqui[c]k
I think a pretty good explanation of that win ratio is that Axis automatically wins when it comes up on a server and nobody is playing. Given that there are a decent number of servers that do the map 24/7, I think that's a thing to consider.
Does it count if no one is there? I've wondered that myself. I think it only counts the stats if people are playing. Take a look at jagd, no one plays that map and it still shows as balanced (relatively). I dunno.

I've been trying to base my judgement on the actual games I've been in. I like to join full servers that have been on it for a couple hours and see what the score is.

I've recently had my schedule free up so I've been plugging away at b5. I'm in the process of wrapping some little things up and then it'll be ready for release.

The map looks great, nice work!

Just a suggestion from a players point of view for your next version. The old Charlie, had a few places on the beach and waterline, that allied snipers could some what safely snipe from, without having to worry about being shelled.

After playing your version, I noticed you would get shelled eventually in all these areas. I also noticed the fog density was a bit to much, to see the axis sand bags on the hill, or inside the bunkers from way back. So, you move up to a trap for cover and to see. What happens? you also get shelled eventually.

This is why the allies are having a hard time getting off the beach, and slants the ballance in the axis favor.

Snipers are a vital part of getting men off the beach in the old charlie. There effectivness, has been reduced at this key moment in this version IMO, and slants the ballance.

It made the map less enjoyable to play than the old charlie, as an allie.

Suggestions:

Reduce the fog density just enough to see these axis areas from the water line, and reduce the shelling at the water line area, or add unshelled "effective cover" at the water line area or beach areas.

Other than this, once off the beach, the map played well, congrats on a nice map..

Well I just want to share this experience.

recently I was on a well-known server, and this map came up. A few people dropped (as happens with map changes) and left us with about 5 on 5. One of the admins remarked that we had too few people to play the map (correct) properly and was thinking about a map change. I asked him not to change it yet - that the map would draw new people. I guaranteed him it would draw people. At first it was slow, causing even a super-genius to doubt his own super-genosity, but within 8 minutes we had a full server. Keep in mind that the server had not even been full before dod_strand came up.

My point is it IS a popular map. The only reasons strand servers are ever empty is the same reason ANY server is empty - newbies don't like joining empty servers, and bot placeholders don't really fool anyone.

Originally posted by Wile E Coyote
and bot placeholders don't really fool anyone. That's the worst plugin ever invented, IMHO, but back on topic.

I don't like the beach maps out, but this one rocks.