I'm having trouble compiling my map. I've used several different versions of zoner's HL tools...2.5.3, 2.5.3 build 1.7, and 3.3. The older versions do not create the bugs, but the light is far less detailed than I would like with those compilers. The 3.3 version creates seemingly random black splotches on my map. I've included some pics to show my predicament. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

I've also tried both regular and -extra compiles for light with each version listed.

http://taien.handsomeboys.org/forumcrap/dod_villa0032.jpg
http://taien.handsomeboys.org/forumcrap/dod_villa0042.jpg

Here's my compile as well:


** Executing...
** Command: Change Directory
** Parameters: "D:\Program Files\Steam\SteamApps\taien@new.rr.com\day of defeat"


** Executing...
** Command: D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\hlcsg.exe
** Parameters: "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa" -chart -texdata 8192 -nowadtextures

hlcsg v3.3 rel 3.3 prerelease (Oct 9 2005)
Zoner's Half-Life Compilation Tools -- Custom Build
Based on code modifications by Sean 'Zoner' Cavanaugh
Based on Valve's version, modified with permission.
Submit detailed bug reports to (amckern@yahoo.com)
----- BEGIN hlcsg -----
Command line: D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\hlcsg.exe "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa"-chart -texdata 8192 -nowadtextures
Entering d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa.map

Current hlcsg Settings
Name | Setting | Default
---------------------|-----------|-------------------------
threads [ 1 ] [ Varies ]
verbose [ off ] [ off ]
log [ on ] [ on ]
developer [ 0 ] [ 0 ]
chart [ on ] [ off ]
estimate [ off ] [ off ]
max texture memory [ 8388608 ] [ 4194304 ]
max lighting memory [ 6291456 ] [ 6291456 ]
priority [ Normal ] [ Normal ]

noclip [ off ] [ off ]
null texture stripping[ on ] [ on ]
clipnode economy mode [ on ] [ on ]
clip hull type [ legacy ] [ legacy ]
onlyents [ off ] [ off ]
wadtextures [ off ] [ on ]
skyclip [ on ] [ on ]
hullfile [ None ] [ None ]
nullfile [ None ] [ None ]
min surface area [ 0.500 ] [ 0.500 ]
brush union threshold [ 0.000 ] [ 0.000 ]

Using mapfile wad configuration
Wadinclude list :
[zhlt.wad]

8 brushes (totalling 46 sides) discarded from clipping hulls
CreateBrush:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (1.39 seconds)
SetModelCenters:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (0.00 seconds)
CSGBrush:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (3.84 seconds)

Object names Objects/Maxobjs Memory / Maxmem Fullness
------------ --------------- --------------- --------
models 0/400 0/25600 ( 0.0)
planes 7926/32768 158520/655360 (24.2)
vertexes 0/65535 0/786420 ( 0.0)
nodes 0/32767 0/786408 ( 0.0)
texinfos 1151/32767 46040/1310680 ( 3.5)
faces 0/65535 0/1310700 ( 0.0)
clipnodes 0/32767 0/262136 ( 0.0)
leaves 0/8192 0/229376 ( 0.0)
marksurfaces 0/65535 0/131070 ( 0.0)
surfedges 0/512000 0/2048000 ( 0.0)
edges 0/256000 0/1024000 ( 0.0)
texdata [variable] 0/8388608 ( 0.0)
lightdata [variable] 0/6291456 ( 0.0)
visdata [variable] 0/2097152 ( 0.0)
entdata [variable] 0/524288 ( 0.0)
0 textures referenced
=== Total BSP file data space used: 204560 bytes ===

Using Wadfile: \program files\steam\steamapps\taien@new.rr.com\day of defeat\dod\dod_castle_vale.wad
- Contains 17 used textures, 17.89 percent of map (63 textures in wad)
Using Wadfile: \program files\valve hammer editor\special wads\allwads.wad
- Contains 72 used textures, 75.79 percent of map (1984 textures in wad)
Using Wadfile: \program files\valve hammer editor\special wads\kami-platinum.wad
- Warning: Larger than expected texture (348972 bytes): '{K_TREE4'
- Contains 6 used textures, 6.32 percent of map (774 textures in wad)

added 3 additional animating textures.
Texture usage is at 5.16 mb (of 8.00 mb MAX)
5.77 seconds elapsed

----- END hlcsg -----




** Executing...
** Command: D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\hlbsp.exe
** Parameters: "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa" -chart -texdata 8192

hlbsp v3.3 rel 3.3 prerelease (Oct 9 2005)
Zoner's Half-Life Compilation Tools -- Custom Build
Based on code modifications by Sean 'Zoner' Cavanaugh
Based on Valve's version, modified with permission.
Submit detailed bug reports to (amckern@yahoo.com)
----- BEGIN hlbsp -----
Command line: D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\hlbsp.exe "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa"-chart -texdata 8192

Current hlbsp Settings
Name | Setting | Default
-------------------|-----------|-------------------------
threads [ 1 ] [ Varies ]
verbose [ off ] [ off ]
log [ on ] [ on ]
developer [ 0 ] [ 0 ]
chart [ on ] [ off ]
estimate [ off ] [ off ]
max texture memory [ 8388608 ] [ 4194304 ]
priority [ Normal ] [ Normal ]

noclip [ off ] [ off ]
nofill [ off ] [ off ]
noopt [ off ] [ off ]
null tex. stripping [ on ] [ on ]
notjunc [ off ] [ off ]
subdivide size [ 240 ] [ 240 ] (Min 64) (Max 512)
max node size [ 1024 ] [ 1024 ] (Min 64) (Max 8192)


SolidBSP [hull 0] 500...1000...1500...2000...2500...3000...3500...40 00...4199 (0.22 seconds)
BSP generation successful, writing portal file 'd:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa.prt'
SolidBSP [hull 1] 500...1000...1500...2000...2500...3000...3500...40 00...4310 (0.23 seconds)
SolidBSP [hull 2] 500...1000...1500...2000...2500...3000...3500...38 71 (0.19 seconds)
SolidBSP [hull 3] 500...1000...1500...2000...2500...3000...3500...40 00...4500...4905 (0.25 seconds)

Object names Objects/Maxobjs Memory / Maxmem Fullness
------------ --------------- --------------- --------
models 117/400 7488/25600 (29.3)
planes 2595/32768 51900/655360 ( 7.9)
vertexes 12284/65535 147408/786420 (18.7)
nodes 4866/32767 116784/786408 (14.9)
texinfos 1151/32767 46040/1310680 ( 3.5)
faces 8646/65535 172920/1310700 (13.2)
clipnodes 14436/32767 115488/262136 (44.1)
leaves 2645/8192 74060/229376 (32.3)
marksurfaces 10714/65535 21428/131070 (16.3)
surfedges 41708/512000 166832/2048000 ( 8.1)
edges 21496/256000 85984/1024000 ( 8.4)
texdata [variable] 5410246/8388608 (64.5)
lightdata [variable] 0/6291456 ( 0.0)
visdata [variable] 0/2097152 ( 0.0)
entdata [variable] 74168/524288 (14.1)
98 textures referenced
=== Total BSP file data space used: 6490746 bytes ===
5.11 seconds elapsed

----- END hlbsp -----




** Executing...
** Command: D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\hlvis.exe
** Parameters: "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa" -full -chart -texdata 8192

hlvis v3.3 rel 3.3 prerelease (Oct 9 2005)
Zoner's Half-Life Compilation Tools -- Custom Build
Based on code modifications by Sean 'Zoner' Cavanaugh
Based on Valve's version, modified with permission.
Submit detailed bug reports to (amckern@yahoo.com)
----- BEGIN hlvis -----
Command line: D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\hlvis.exe "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa"-full -chart -texdata 8192
1862 portalleafs
5110 numportals

-= Current hlvis Settings =-
Name | Setting | Default
-------------------|-----------|-------------------------
threads [ 1 ] [ Varies ]
verbose [ off ] [ off ]
log [ on ] [ on ]
developer [ 0 ] [ 0 ]
chart [ on ] [ off ]
estimate [ off ] [ off ]
max texture memory [ 8388608 ] [ 4194304 ]
max vis distance [ 0 ] [ 0 ]
priority [ Normal ] [ Normal ]

fast vis [ off ] [ off ]
full vis [ on ] [ off ]


BasePortalVis:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (4.66 seconds)
LeafThread:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (292.55 seconds)
average leafs visible: 154
g_visdatasize:150988 compressed from 433846

Object names Objects/Maxobjs Memory / Maxmem Fullness
------------ --------------- --------------- --------
models 117/400 7488/25600 (29.3)
planes 2595/32768 51900/655360 ( 7.9)
vertexes 12284/65535 147408/786420 (18.7)
nodes 4866/32767 116784/786408 (14.9)
texinfos 1151/32767 46040/1310680 ( 3.5)
faces 8646/65535 172920/1310700 (13.2)
clipnodes 14436/32767 115488/262136 (44.1)
leaves 2645/8192 74060/229376 (32.3)
marksurfaces 10714/65535 21428/131070 (16.3)
surfedges 41708/512000 166832/2048000 ( 8.1)
edges 21496/256000 85984/1024000 ( 8.4)
texdata [variable] 5410246/8388608 (64.5)
lightdata [variable] 0/6291456 ( 0.0)
visdata [variable] 150988/2097152 ( 7.2)
entdata [variable] 74168/524288 (14.1)
98 textures referenced
=== Total BSP file data space used: 6641734 bytes ===
297.41 seconds elapsed [4m 57s]

----- END hlvis -----




** Executing...
** Command: D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\hlrad.exe
** Parameters: "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa" -lightdata 8192 -chart -texdata 8192

hlrad v3.3 rel 3.3 prerelease (Oct 9 2005)
Zoner's Half-Life Compilation Tools -- Custom Build
Based on code modifications by Sean 'Zoner' Cavanaugh
Based on Valve's version, modified with permission.
Submit detailed bug reports to (amckern@yahoo.com)
----- BEGIN hlrad -----
Command line: D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\hlrad.exe "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa"-lightdata 8192 -chart -texdata 8192

-= Current hlrad Settings =-
Name | Setting | Default
--------------------|---------------------|-------------------------
threads [ 1 ] [ Varies ]
verbose [ off ] [ off ]
log [ on ] [ on ]
developer [ 0 ] [ 0 ]
chart [ on ] [ off ]
estimate [ off ] [ off ]
max texture memory [ 8388608 ] [ 4194304 ]
max lighting memory [ 8388608 ] [ 6291456 ]
priority [ Normal ] [ Normal ]

vismatrix algorithm [ Original ] [ Original ]
oversampling (-extra)[ off ] [ off ]
bounces [ 1 ] [ 1 ]
bounce dynamic light [ on ] [ on ]
ambient light [ 0.000 0.000 0.000 ] [ 0.000 0.000 0.000 ]
maximum light [ 255.000 ] [ 256.000 ]
circus mode [ off ] [ off ]

smoothing threshold [ 50.000 ] [ 50.000 ]
direct threshold [ 25.000 ] [ 25.000 ]
direct light scale [ 2.000 ] [ 2.000 ]
coring threshold [ 1.000 ] [ 1.000 ]
patch interpolation [ on ] [ on ]

texscale [ on ] [ on ]
patch subdividing [ on ] [ on ]
chop value [ 64.000 ] [ 64.000 ]
texchop value [ 32.000 ] [ 32.000 ]

global fade [ 1.000 ] [ 1.000 ]
global falloff [ 2 ] [ 2 ]
global light scale [ 1.000 1.000 1.000 ] [ 1.000 1.000 1.000 ]
global gamma [ 0.500 0.500 0.500 ] [ 0.500 0.500 0.500 ]
global light scale [ 1.000 ] [ 1.000 ]
global sky diffusion [ 1.000 ] [ 1.000 ]

opaque entities [ on ] [ on ]
sky lighting fix [ on ] [ on ]
incremental [ off ] [ off ]
dump [ off ] [ off ]

colour jitter [ 0.0 0.0 0.0 ] [ 0.0 0.0 0.0 ]
monochromatic jitter [ 0.0 0.0 0.0 ] [ 0.0 0.0 0.0 ]
softlight hack [ 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 ] [ 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 ]
diffuse hack [ on ] [ on ]
spotlight points [ on ] [ on ]

custom shadows with bounce light
[ off ] [ off ]
rgb transfers [ off ] [ off ]


[Reading texlights from 'D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\lights.rad']
[59 texlights parsed from 'D:\PROGRA~1\VALVEH~1\COMPIL~1\lights.rad']

8646 faces
Create Patches : 52908 base patches
48 opaque faces
488535 square feet [70349072.00 square inches]
46 direct lights

BuildFacelights:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (89.66 seconds)
visibility matrix : 166.9 megs
BuildVisLeafs:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (673.03 seconds)
MakeScales:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (138.33 seconds)
SwapTransfers:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (6.17 seconds)
Transfer Lists : 41147040 : 41.15M transfers
Indices : 18709596 : 17.84M bytes
Data : 164588160 : 156.96M bytes
Bounce 1 GatherLight:
Warning: Too many light styles on a face(1551.989990,224.800018,424.000000)
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (5.25 seconds)
FinalLightFace:
10%...20%...30%...40%...50%...60%...70%...80%...90 %... (11.73 seconds)

Object names Objects/Maxobjs Memory / Maxmem Fullness
------------ --------------- --------------- --------
models 117/400 7488/25600 (29.3)
planes 2595/32768 51900/655360 ( 7.9)
vertexes 12284/65535 147408/786420 (18.7)
nodes 4866/32767 116784/786408 (14.9)
texinfos 1151/32767 46040/1310680 ( 3.5)
faces 8646/65535 172920/1310700 (13.2)
clipnodes 14436/32767 115488/262136 (44.1)
leaves 2645/8192 74060/229376 (32.3)
marksurfaces 10714/65535 21428/131070 (16.3)
surfedges 41708/512000 166832/2048000 ( 8.1)
edges 21496/256000 85984/1024000 ( 8.4)
texdata [variable] 5410246/8388608 (64.5)
lightdata [variable] 6213210/8388608 (74.1)
visdata [variable] 150988/2097152 ( 7.2)
entdata [variable] 74168/524288 (14.1)
98 textures referenced
=== Total BSP file data space used: 12854944 bytes ===
926.91 seconds elapsed [15m 26s]

----- END hlrad -----




** Executing...
** Command: Copy File
** Parameters: "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa.bsp" "D:\Program Files\Steam\SteamApps\taien@new.rr.com\day of defeat\dod\maps\dod_villa.bsp"


** Executing...
** Command: Copy File
** Parameters: "d:\program files\valve hammer editor\maps\dod_villa.pts" "D:\Program Files\Steam\SteamApps\taien@new.rr.com\day of defeat\dod\maps\dod_villa.pts"

Well the HL1 engine doesnt exactly have a beast of a lighting pipeline but if you want more detailed lighting try upping the BOUNCE peram in ZHLT

I hav'nt done hl1 mapping in over a year so i don't remember exactly how to go about this

Nono, the detail is fine...I like how it gradually fades as you get farther from the light source. The problem is that the rad program is generating these random areas of shadow as shown in the pics. If you want more pics, I can get more areas where this has happened....there are at least 3 more areas I can think of within this map.

I've pretty much decided now that the hlrad program I'm using is the problem....because older compilers don't generate the wierd shadows. The problem is that with older compilers, the light detail is hugely affected. I could show you an example of the difference if you'd like.

ahhh ... you mean the players shadow being the problem ... I wondered what it was that was wrong there.

Show us a pic from older compiler tools, just so we can compare.

You want to look at the VERC forums, they might be of more help here.


EDIT: Tommy14 says:

player models take their light from the nearest REGULAR brush that is UNDER them. entity brushes do not count.

I remember this now, it's the same reason some mappers had problems with some models showing up black in their maps. I bet this is to do with Older compiler tools egnoring the NULL texture.

I assume you have used the NULL texture on unseen faces of brushes?

That's correct, I use null on all faces that would not normally be visible. Basically I create my maps with all null texture and then just texture the visible faces.

But no, I'm not talking about the player shadows...it's kind of hard to describe the problem. I'll post some more pics in just a few here. In the ones I already posted, notice how there are incorrect shadows in some areas....like the ceiling of the staircase room in that one pic, or in the same pic, the floor right at the bottom of the screen.

BTW haircut, I couldn't find the older versions of ZHLT on that site. They have 3.4 posted there, but when I clikc the link to see the older versions it just takes me to another site that doesn't seem ot have them hosted in its file section anymore. :(

I should get off my butt one of these days and make a DOD:Classic information compendium site or something. I've already made some tutorials on my clan's forums. :p

OK.

I still think it's related to the NULL texture.

Old compiler tools don't recognise the texture so when it compiles it will draw it as a normal face.

The new compiler tools will recognise the texture, removing the face from the map during compile time.

This is only a problem when you have something like a func_wall, used on maybe your staircase or something simular, looking at the picture it's difficult to see what's under or above the black shadow. The brush behind it might be a brush with the NULL texture on it. So the faces above/below the func_wall might get their light/shadow from the Void, Black.

As an experimant could you replace the NULL with something like your own simple coloured texture, something that wouldn't be removed or do the tools have a switch to turn off the removal of faces with the NULL texture on. This way you could compile with the new tools and see the effect or not.

At this point I might be way off with this ...

If it's not NULL related then maybe posting a few more pics will help find the problem. I did say I have this problem myself sometimes but then again I built my maps in the same way, everything was built with the NULL texture first.


Either that or just re-do the map for source ... :kitty:

Let me see if I understand...

So I shouldn't have null texture on any func_ items is pretty much the idea? Texture all sides?

After reading your message I tried to do as you suggested and indeed it did fix a coupl of the light bugs. I didn't try too hard, just a little work to see if it would have an effect, and it did....so I'll let you know if this fixes everything. I had no idea that textures could recieve light from a null texture touching them from a func. And also, I actually had no idea about that lights.rad file before you explained that too. :p

Thanks haircut :)

It's not that the func_wall touches the face of a brush with the NULL texture on it.

Remember that a func_wall brush doesn't block light.



This might help:


----- brush making your Ceiling


0
/|\ You, without legs.

----- brush made into a func_wall because that's what you did, staircase etc ...


----- brush with NULL

Void





What is happening is the ceiling and you are getting its light source from the brush underneth it.

If this is a func_wall then you wont get the light from it you will get the light from the next brush underneath that.

In this case it would be the normal brush with the NULL texture on it. But as this now has no faces you then get the light from the void, black. Remember that any face that has the NULL texture on it is removed at compiler time, before the light is calculated.