Feedback on Dijon

01-22-2006, 11:43 AM
I've been fixing some very minor bugs lately (such as textures, or misplaced brushes) and would like to hear more from the players about the map in its current form (rc2) and what could be done to improve it. Please develop your opinions beyond "it rocks" or "it sucks". That's not helpful.

Obviously major changes aren't going to be implemented, the general layout will remain the way it is, but I can make minor modifications to improve balance or access to specific areas.

So far my changelist is:

- Fixed various models drawing distance
- Improved architecture => better FPS in the main street area.
- Fixed front entrance arches of church
- Improved texturing
- Fixed entire wine shop flag cap zone -> ground floor only to cap flag
- HDR cubemaps

I'm thinking of closing the house farthest on the left when going for the allies first as axis. As it stands today, there are 3 ways to the allies first and only 2 to the axis first, which on top of that is in a more open area. I believe it is therefore less easily defendable by the allies. I'd like to hear your opinion on this

Thanks for your input and help :)

01-22-2006, 11:54 AM
I think it's important to remember servers that have 32 players. The clan I'm a part of runs a 32 person server and we have this map in rotation because it's one of the best. However, many maps that run fine on smaller servers can lag a little on servers with more players like ours. I think it's great that you're optimizing it more, and I can only say do as much as you can. Mainstreet does have fps issues, but so does the inside of the church at times. Also, If you're on top of the church, fps can drop considerably, but I suspect that's part of the mainstreet issue. Another thing to consider right now is that it's easier for axist to spawn camp allies, simply because allies come from the ground and axis drop out of windows. Good work on the map, and I hope it'll play smoothe:D

01-22-2006, 12:57 PM
The main part of the main street optimization has been done in a couple seconds by turning the upper windows of the Hotel into func_detail entities. I simply had forgot to turn them back to func_detail after changing them a bit in rc1... I dropped my leaf counts by a couple hundred just doing that....

The truth is that the mainstreet probably can't be optimized more than it is now. At least not by any means I know of currently. The flaw is in the design, the street is too large/too detailed. It may just be that I've gone overboard with the models there. However with that single change I'm confident you'll see a good increase of performance, particularly when facing the axis spawn on the church first floor.

I've also got rid of some misplaced hints. As I have yet to compile the map, I can't comment on the performance gain if any for now.

As far as the church is concerned, I haven't noticed any bad performance. To be honest it must be the most optimized part of the map yet. It contains the full range of Source tools to gain performance. If your performance drop happens when entering the church from the front entrance, I'm afraid I can't do much about that, as it's the occluder that would be causing it.

01-22-2006, 01:15 PM
I really enjoy Dijon. I've had no performance issues with it. I like the idea of requiring two people to get your spawn back. Great job.

01-22-2006, 10:07 PM
I actually just played it, I don't know what I was thinking about the church. But i do have some new thoughts. It is very easy for the allies to be camped at their spawn that goes to he winery, an mg or sniper can easily inhabit the building across from the spawn and raise hell. But like i said before it's harder for allies to do this to axis because they drop out of windows. My suggestion is making the very top window in the church (the one used in the ava church) breakable so that an allied sniper or mg could set up on the ledge it leaves and camp the axis. You may feel the need to change the lighting in the church once the window breaks, but honestly it's not something I think a lot of people would notice or care about, and would probably only hinder performance.

01-23-2006, 12:38 AM
first off this map is amazing, second i thinkthe axis spawn needs to be fixed, starting on the first floor and then having to go upstairs, walk through a long hall, and then jump out a window is way to much to do just to get out of the spawn.Third is the winery/bar i think it needs one more exit/entrace and it should be from the top floor. Either have a ladder coming from the first floor to the upstairs window, or connect the building across from it via window to window with a bridge/roof arc/wooden plank. Thats all i can think of for now, keep up the good work.

01-23-2006, 04:11 AM
Thx for those replies, here are some comments:

allies spawn camping: It's not because it's easier to do on one side that I should fix it by allowing it on the other. If anything it should be the other way around.

The church stained glass window can not be broken or FPS go right out the window with it. Right now the interior of the church is not rendered when standing on the main street, and that's a 20 FPS jump. You break the window and you lose those FPS.

During playtesting, the axis were always thought to be at a disadvantage because once out of spawn they had to cross a pretty big open area. It also took too much time for them to get out and into the church (2 seconds after allies got there).

As it stands now, both axis and allies arrive in the church at the same time, and I intend to keep it that way. I can however drop the ground floor spawn points and have everyone start at the first floor.

I like the idea of having a third entrance into the wine shop. I'll look into the ladder solution.

As for allies spawn camping, I think adding a fourth way out of spawn for them would help in preventing it. I used to have the house right after the left exit open, and I'll look into having it that way again.


01-23-2006, 10:17 AM
i love the map. great gameplay on the map.. and i like the secret area in it :-P we managed to get a cease fire in our (full) server, and get all 32 players in it. in the second part of it. other than our clan members, then we the whole clan lobbed nades in just before the door closed :-P only bad part was when we almost all got kicked/banned for TKs :-P that was a fun time.

*note: they were mostly all regulars, so they didnt mind too much :-P they always enjoy the laugh at us getting banned from our own server for 5 minutes

01-23-2006, 10:52 AM
Wish I could have been there :D

01-23-2006, 07:43 PM
yea furyo its good i remmber beta testing it in CS back in the 907th lol
i'm very happy with the end good work :D

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