Ruined buildings?

01-16-2006, 06:07 AM
I was wondering if the ruined building effect can be done quickly, relistically and cheaply (perf-wise) in the new Hammer?

An example is in the left of this picture:

The wall shown is very curvy, currently the only way I'd be able to do that is make the wall with lots of brushes (I think it'd be at least 10) then a displacement on top of those.

It would probably take about half an hour for me to do that one section. Is that the correct way?

otF yetihw
01-16-2006, 08:19 AM
Which part?

That building on the very left centre with the curvy walls is a model. I think it can be found in the props_debris folder.

The walls on either side of the hole in the main building are made of lots of brushes, and are probably made to look nice with displacements.

El Capitan
01-16-2006, 09:21 AM
Extract the dod_flash source file from the source SDK .gcf and take a look at how its done there on the ruined building and the walls to the back of it.

The actual building itself is constructed from models to create the nice "smooth" effect.

The walls behind, like the sides of the destroyed centre building in the picture you posted can be created from creating just one brush and then subdivide it into 2 or 3 and then use the paint geometry tool (left click raises surface, right click lowers) to create the "rough" effect to your liking.

01-16-2006, 11:32 AM
Okay, got it. When should I be using models and when brushwork?

Surely models are a bit annoying to use as you can't scale them...

El Capitan
01-16-2006, 11:50 AM
Originally posted by Kid-A
Okay, got it. When should I be using models and when brushwork?

Surely models are a bit annoying to use as you can't scale them...

Yeah models are annoying to use, they are scaled for that particular map. So unless you are a pro modeller and want to make them yourself, you have to make do with the models are available.

Take a look at prop_debris and browse through the various destroyed walls/buildings there. The flash_destroyed_foundation ones are the ones used in flash and I think maybe in the picture you posted.

Theres no time you "should" be using models or brushwork, its all about your own judgement really. Its good to use models where you can as long as you don't have too many. They look better as well!

When placing the destroyed debris models in your map, the best way to go about it is to put the models in and then build up your brushwork around it so you don't have to keep making adjustments to your brushes later on.

If you don't like how the models look in your map, or if there are a lot of models in the area of your map already, its best to just stick to brushwork!

01-17-2006, 03:03 AM
And all models are pre-clipped/slef-clipping now?

Ginger Lord
01-17-2006, 05:19 AM
Yes. Thank god.

01-17-2006, 06:20 AM
Originally posted by Ginger Lord
Yes. Thank god.

El Capitan
01-17-2006, 07:56 AM
Being able to browse the models, put them in pre-clipped and rotate/align them in hammer is a lifesaver now!!

01-19-2006, 01:50 AM
There's also the handy feature of automaticaly placing entities; Just use the entity placer and click on a terrian/brush in the 3D view and it puts it right on top :D
Saves butt loads of time for hill maps with lots of trees on them.

(dont forget to use the copy and paste buttons in the alt+enter window)

01-20-2006, 12:09 AM
So far in my mapping experience I've found debris and broken walls to be the easiest and most satisfying thing to do. Personally, I'm not really a fan of the models, though they might be better for performance (woops).

If I want to make a broken wall I vertically clip it into however many parts will allow me to roughly simulate (with vertex manipulation) the shape I want it to have. And if its something with like plaster or wall paper or something over the structure then I copy the wall inside itself, change the texture, make it like 1 or 2 units narrower, displace the sides and top of each brush to act as the more rounded broken stone or concrete or whatever, while the initial brushes remain jagged.

To round it just use Raise To rather than Raise/Lower. Then use Raise/Lower to make it natural looking.

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