OLD PICS

http://montemaps.tripod.com/montesmaps/id9.html

OLD PICS


EDIT: All interested in playtesting give me a holler via PM, topic - aftermathtest please and I will give you a link to the download (beta1)




NEW PICS ...

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421529981/7.jpg

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421529981/6.jpg

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421529981/5.jpg

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421529981/4.jpg




http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421529981/3.jpg

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421529981/2.jpg

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421529981/1.jpg

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421529981/0.jpg

It's got promise, keep it up!

Tnx, but I really need to stress that I want critiques, what is sh*t about the map and what do you like about it and why, not trying to be mean but i just really need to know what I can improve on so i can make it better and more enjoyable for all :)


For example, i was thinking of implementing a secondary objeective for each team, that would have an effect on the environment, for example - See that axis tank, the allied secondary objective is to destroy it with a rocket launcher, causing the tank to explode and "crash thru the ground" crushing the sewers, meaning axis can't enter thru them anymore.


Good idea or crap? Just gimme ur opinions


Tnx :)

That sounds pretty cool. Or you could use Jed's exploding tree model and at some point a bomb hits it and it blocks of a route or something.

The map looks good, if not a little bland. Maybe making 3 test versions mid-day, dusk, and night - just to see whats possible and for gameplay reasons :) I suggest dusk IMO to get that sexy look :D

Keep up the work mate :)

*EDIT NEW IDEA* This is going with Jed's trees again :p
Maybe you could use the trees to explode and fall into a building knocking out a wall and creating a new attacking route?

here we go.

one thing that stands out alot on all pics ( so ill do that first)
is the lack of seriously thinking about what kinda texture combo's your making will these colors and styles match ?
oviusly ( correct me if im wrong) you didnt :) you just took the textures you think look good and went building by building not thinking about the general look.. which in the end caused a textural mess.
your not the only one around here doing that though :)
personally i try and use all textures of the same author ( most of the times kleineh@$@$)
for the general look and generic stuff(wood,doors enz) from whomever

now on to the brushwork

is this your first full map ? id have to take that into concideration
so unless you state otherwise ill go with that.

i see alot of simple buildings without even a roof, most of the times theyre to wide and have textures repeat over them, to a point were it be comes repeatative and very unlikly.
example pic: the last one 0.jpg .. you have the same shop texture repeat 3 times and no roof, very basic
try and add more variation to your brushwork.

the streets in general feel empty, try and add more detail , its broken put some debris down there .. add some doors to house with litle stairs infront .. barrels , cars, lampposts, smoke earth wind and fire :P fill it up.

onto the broken stuff:
the walls are way to thin look at war movies pay atention to the broken walls, theyre prety thick, and which brings me to the next point material, try and stay true to the material when you make broken stuff .. bricks and riverstone dont have smooth edges when it breaks, i know the old engine doesnt always allow that , but whenever you can mind the material :)

the building infront (http://montemaps.tripod.com//sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/4.jpg)
glass doesnt break this way .. those windows would be torn out leaving the window suport beams and shape of the window visable is an excelent way of doing this ( low poly aswell)

broken house on the left (http://montemaps.tripod.com//sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/2.jpg)
again very thin walls and theres no pavement underneath houses m8 :P
also this looks like a three story house yet you only made one putting the ceiling up way high, creating the caen effect (houses for giants) which waldo fixed nicely this release.

the doorframe infront (http://montemaps.tripod.com//sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/18.jpg)
how about you align that wood to be vertical instead of horizontal :)
i saw it on a couple of other pics aswell , texture alignment is important. make sure you get it right.

overview (http://montemaps.tripod.com//sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/20.jpg)
make sure you use null or sky on unseen faces( all the tops of your houses and i bet the back and underneath).. they wont be rendered that way

ok thats it for now :)

i know you "fixed some of the points i adressed but i didnt see them so i thought it wouldnt hurt to point them out anyway as it could be usefull for other parts

keep it up

I'm more focused on the overview. Textures and brushes are great .. but if the map plays like crap .. whats the point?

Hopefully the buildings that are on the inside of your routes can be completely explored/utilized. If not, then you have a pretty confined map.

Three things that are a must for a good map. Multiple exits from spawn, facing in different directions. Proper spacing of flags. Multiple (3 or more) access points to your center flag.

A good example of the above is Donner. A bad example is Chemille.

Can't wait to see it.

YES! Those are the kind of critiques I want, thankyou very much.


Now, IR, yes - I have added tables/bookcases (thrown out of windows) as well as curved stairways leading up into a couple buildings for cover in the streets.

as for the picture about how the house wouldnt break like that, in pic 5 im assuming - I have fixed that up

Originally posted by IR
broken house on the left (http://montemaps.tripod.com//sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/2.jpg)
again very thin walls and theres no pavement underneath houses m8 :P
also this looks like a three story house yet you only made one putting the ceiling up way high, creating the caen effect (houses for giants) which waldo fixed nicely this release.


I do actually have a floor in there, but that would make it only 2 floors and i guess it would still be a 'house fit for a giant' ill fix it up :)

Textures- Yes, although, for the insides of my houses for wallpaper ive kept a theme of kl_noowp3 for a basic texture (it goes with everything!) Ill work on the texturing


Architecture - What ive been doing is rebuilding a few of the buildings to give them more curvy geometry, because i felt the mapoverall was too "boxy"


Overview - Yes, all the buildings you see on the overview *inside the paths* are enterable, however, the houses outside the walls are not.

Yes there are 3 exits to each spawn, and i designed this map with gameplay in mind, just to give you an idea, it takes roughly 23 seconds to reach middle flag, (22 for axis)


*Question - I have a sewer (there was only 1 screenshot of it) For lighting should I use a normal light entity or should i use a point light? Which do you think would look better

* Also should I add more than just axis entrance and allied entrance to sewers and have other entrances pop up?

looks good, i would like to see some tileso n the buildings, they seem very flat.

the streets look kinda plane and open ... perhaps add some rubber or sandbags or something....other than it being really open between the buildings and whatnot ... it looks good

Some in-editor pics, of a few of the new buildings and looks to buildings ive added... gimme ur opinions :)

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421515509/0.jpg

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421515509/1.jpg

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421515509/2.jpg

walls are 2 thin and the wallpaper on the last pic looks repetitive + 2 clean for suchs a broken building :)

alot better then last pics though

Any ideas to lessen that monotony? Perhaps adding different wallpaper in spots, but that wouldn't make sense would it?


ALSO, for the lighting in my sewers I can't figure out for the life of me what exactly to do, i wanted to do something like in donner...

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421515722/0.jpg

However, I'm not sure how he got that nice nice lighting effect (inner radius is slightly diff color, and the light fills the room with a certain... something)


comments?

I generally make the main walls 16 units thick, and the inner walls (the ones that seperate bedrooms from the hallway and such) 8 units.

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421515509/2.jpg
I like how you have the remains of some of the floors, but you don't have any remains from any verticle walls in there. Try adding some broken walls inbetween the broken floors, and then vary the wall paper texture from room to room. Houses don't generally have the same wall paper in every room and hallway.

Cool, thats what I was thinking, i actually already put a bathtub model in a room that ive made since that screenshot, but I will vary the wallpaper... new pics coming as soon as I finish a few more things on map

*BTW* Retextured the chokepoint with lots of blazeers wad textures, giving it a more 1 wadish type of feel, per IR's suggestion....


Any ideas on how to get that pimp looking lighting effect? I might have to make a testmap if nobody knows off the bat

A third entrance into your sewer is preferable. That way you can sneak behind someone camping your entrance, or can go down below midway through the map if the action gets to hot.

I'm not sure if it's like this yet, but the wallpaper (and most textures for that matter) should be kept proportionate. So if it's only .5 hight, you should make the width .5 as well, or else areas start to look really odd. I think if there were a few different wallpapers in that 3 storey building it'd break up the repetition since most houses have different wallpaper in every room.

Now , your map looks great , but i can tell you more , then i can test your map . Images say nothing . Playtests are better .

Sure Oberf, I could send you over an alpha compile, once I finish i few minor things (retexture a few buidings) If that's what you're asking..

@ Gorbachev - Yes I have retextured that building with a few different wallpapers

I can wait for your final .

New pics of the MAJOR changes to the map coming Tues/Wed!

@ Gorbachev - Per your suggestion I spent a lot of time fixing odd textures that had uneven scaling

@ IR - Retextured much of the map to fit in with one wad, however, I still have a few buildings with diff textures for flavor

+New routes have been added
+new areas
+5 new buildings have been added
+2 have been completely rebuilt from the ground up
+Added cover in streets - market stalls, tables, cabinets, wooden beams etc.
+Axis spawn area Redux


Stay tuned

I know they don't work atm, but some mortar support would be nice, with the hit zones and the useable models and stuff, and an Easter egg. Every map should have an easter egg.

EDIT: WOW! The color really got drained... just use your imagination

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421517894/0.jpg

Ok so what I think im gonna have to do is take out this wonderful building, (it has different wallpapers now :) ) due to r_speeds, I will replace it with something a little more wpoly friendly...


http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421517894/1.jpg

New house

http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421517894/2.jpg

New house (unenterable)


More INGAME pics coming soon(TM)

OMFG TEH PICS


http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/0.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/1.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/2.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/3.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/4.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/5.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/6.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/7.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/8.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/9.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/10.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/11.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/14.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/13.jpg
http://www2.freepichosting.com/Images/421519153/12.jpg


NEW ROUTE ADDED - It goes through the buildings along the left side of the middle flag area (from allies POV)

R_SPEED REDUCTION

RETEXTURE

REDUX OMFG!!!!1

Disclaimer : More rubble will be re added, as it was taken out while I was rebuilding certain areas of the map...


EDIT: Expect a beta release very very shortly

Will get u all more pics tommorow I need to rest for a bit, Ive been mapping non stop ... for some time now.

monte, it looks like your on the right path but I got a few tips to make your map more eye pleasing.

- vary the size of buildings in your map by width and height. (height very important) This can "break things up" and make your map more realistic looking by adding variety.

- try adding more to your buildings, instead of just making it a block with a texture. fiddle around with different architecture and roofs.

- right now some of your buildings look very long like a whole length of a long street, while good in some cases I feel it looks off in your map with the textures.

- look around in other maps and pay attention to detail and how other mappers do things, other maps can be great inspiration but always let your creative mind flow by adding your own touch.


good luck, it's looking promising so far.

Actually many of my buildings have "curved edges" as the kids say these days...

As well, the height does vary, I will post some screens showing the differences in architecture and height, those were just some quick screens.


Might____ be releasing a playtesting beta tommorow

we'd play test - www.rrsyndicate.com to contact us

NEW PICS FIRST POST

Look for a release soon...

I am currently looking for playtesters (only refutable ppl plz)

Looking better and better every time you post new pics.

Btw did you try with a darker sky and darker light?

A gloomy atmosphere might serve your map better, imo.

All interested in playtesting give me a holler and I can give you a link to the download

OMG DEFFINATELY INTERESTED!

*sent pm*

Right, came back from a quick run around.

I was impressed by the size of the map. I loved the fact that you could pretty much get in every building. I ran around all the rubble and didn't get stuck at all. However there is one part by the axis second flag where you step up a few pixels higher (which is quite strange)

Also there is a building with the back walls missing so all you see is the big white space from the out side of the map (only visible from a building window)

IMO, the map looks very bland. I suggest moody lighting, darkish lights and maybe rain, to get a more atmospheric feeling. I also suggest more dark, gritty and grungy brushes, remember this is war :) To combat the dark and lighting have some burning rubble and houses along the path and street lights.

Well, it looks like I am going to have to release it as is, the .qrk file has become corrupted (i had it stored ona floppy disk so i could upload it to pc after i reformatted and reinstalled os)

However, now that I try to open it with quark it gives me all kinds of floating point errors, and I'm sure its the file because I can save/open other files... this saddens me because I know I could have made some tweaks and made it a bit cooler... and I could have put in a REAL easter egg :(

Guess I'll make a release thread now ... damnit... ... ...

:(
Can't you just decompile the map and work on it from there?